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Politics and beating the morality drums

  • Thread starterCuster Laststand
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Custer Laststand

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Jul 18, 2007
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The trials and tribulations of the erstwhile Governor of New York, E.S., would seem to be further evidence in support of the observation that those who beat the morality drums most loudly are usually engaged, secretly, in some form of immoral behavior themselves — where "immoral behavior," as defined by the self-righteous, virtually always means engaging in some form of sexual behavior differing from mainstream norms.

In any case, if E.S. is "client 9," one wonders who "client 1" is... and "clients 2 thru 8," and "clients 10 thru 50"... —? I mean, was that a selective leak, or what?

"Democracy Now" makes the interesting point that the wiretapping which captured E.S. was initiated while A.G. was still in office as U.S. Attorney General. (You will recall, no doubt, that A.G. resigned under heavy bipartisan pressure due to... let's see, how to put this delicately... some suspicion he was using the U.S. Dept. of Justice to go after folks the administration viewed [/views] as political opponents.) "Democracy Now" went on to point out that when "the goods" were obtained on E.S., the wire taps were hastily removed — although the FBI court order would have enabled them to continue considerably longer — and, also, that it's highly unusual to release the name of a "person of interest" this early in an investigation, before charges are filed. It's hard to avoid the suspicion that the wiretappers must have found themselves recording too many high-level folks and important political donors.

Any with opinions as to whether charges of any kind will *ever* be filed against E.S. please feel free to state them. Possibilities include, but are not limited to, the following.

(1) No, there would be no point — his career as a rising political star has effectively been terminated.

(2) Yes, he will be charged with violating the Mann Act, under which it is a federal crime to transport a female or females across state lines (NY city to Wash DC in this case) for an act (/acts) of ************.

(3) No, he will not be charged for violating the Mann Act, because he did not transport the woman, she transported herself — and prosecution of a "client" under the Mann Act would, in any case, be highly unusual.

(4) He won't be charged with anything by the feds, in part because of (3), but they will turn their evidence over to the State of New York for prosecution because New York has a law (promoted and signed, ironically, by E.S. himself) under which it is a state crime to solicit for ************.

(5) [4] will happen, but after a long delay that will be attributed to judicial backlogs and the need for "further investigation," the case will quietly be dropped — mainly because those who would have to prosecute it will not want to create a precedent under which they themselves might be charged and convicted in the future.

(7) Other possibilities.... fill in the blank _________ .
 
My thoughts

Who says sex boards aren't intellectual. A little politics with your sex, I love it. Why not. Apparently the politicians do too.

Here's my thought.

1) NO ONE should ever go to jail just for getting laid (assuming it's between two or more consenting adults).

2) Political "gotcha" games like these have been going on since Ancient Rome, more likely even before. The lesson: If you're gonna play in that arena watch your back, and always remember the immortal words of John Holmes as Johnny Wad "Sometimes the fuckin' you do just ain't worth the fuckin' you're gonna get".

3) Even if he did use his own money to pay for sex (which in my book is perfectly fine), he should lose his job as Governor. Remember, this is a man who made his bones prosecuting others for doing the exact same thing.
I'll take a pervert over a fucking hypocrite any day of the week!
 
Hmmm

As usual I am sure it will be hard to get a consensus on ideals.
I for one tend to have no problem with not feeling very sorry for the now ex governor. He didn't mind throwing the book at many others over the years.
I agree that those that scream the loudest often are the ones that fall in to the very snare they warn against.
Could be that the wise old book saying is very true, "beware lest ye also, being led away with the error of the wicked, fall from your own stedfastness." "Pride goeth before destruction, and an haughty spirit before a fall." "Wherefore let him that thinketh he standeth take heed lest he fall." "Pride goeth before destruction, and an haughty spirit before a fall."
My point being, no matter if a judge, President, AG, or just you or I when we get to the place that we forget that there are rules, laws, and people watching us or we think we are bigger, smarter, wiser, we fall into our own traps.
Rather or not he goes to jail does not really matter for he already lost all that was really important to him. His reputation, integrity, wife, position.
Now let me for a moment bring it to the subject of this forum. I often say this can be a wonderful life style and if two people are very much in love and trust that love then there is an understanding that sex is a mutual game for pleasure and love making is the prize between the couple after the sex with strangers or bf's. Many a story has been posted here where couples cross the lines, forget the rules take on a regular boy Friend and the end almost always ends bad for the husband. Some advocate for a wife to cheat on her husband or the other way around. That is a fools game and will most certainly end in someone being hurt very badly.
If there is one thing you can be sure of it is For nothing is secret, that shall not be made manifest; neither any thing hid, that shall not be known and come abroad." Wifes find out, husbands find out, and no one likes to find out he was in the dark, lied too, their trust violated. And don't be foolish enough to believe all the crap that get posted here saying how men loved finding out the woman that they loved with all their heart fucked around on them, because that is crap. They may grow to accept it, even in a perverted way learn to like it, but when they first found out they didn't, because it said, baby I might love you but I sure as hell am not in love with you, I stay with you for your money, or family or whatever but you did not meet my wants and needs. For a couple to make it each person has to meet the needs of the other person. Trust, love, enjoying, is just a few that must be met.
Try to be gay in the closet and someone will find you out. Be a preacher that pays chicks to undress for you and it will get found out. Have an affair and you will get caught. Steal, lie, cheat, you might get by for awhile but in the end it will become known. So have integrity, be who you are, live what you claim to others then you won't get caught losing it all.
My two cents.
 
On the mark

Well tuppinsinmo, sometimes I disagree with you and other times you're right. (If you agree with me, you're right. :)) This is one of those right on the mark times.

He took out a lot of people both who did and did not deserve it. For example, he was behind the big Putnam funds case. They lost billions of money under management and lots of people lost their jobs. Did anyone put it all back when the independent investigation results were published and stated that Putnam did nothing illegal and the employees that had broken the rules had been discovered, fined and or fired before Spitzer ever heard of it. Also their standard of care exceeded accepted industry practice.

I love seeing Spitzer crash and burn on a crime that shouldn't even be illegal. It's sort of like poetic justice. I don't see very many people unhappy about it. He was a pompous prick.
 
Hippocrisy

The cocksucker[OR CIVIL SERVANT]was nothing more then a degenarate,usa politics and world politics are the same thing,when it comes 2 bullshiting the folks who r descent and work hard for their money ,have pimps or lawyers same thing who r telling them its against the law,2 play with your cock,while they fuck or try 2 fuck everything that moves around them and even pay 4 sex,with the tax payers money, fucking political scum bugs so i dedicate this poem 2 the scum and corrupted who speak about the moral majority shit.Life is a bitch and then u die, tell all the politicians 2 go and fuck their [god$] and we go and fuck our juicy sluts and get high.
 
Re. Elliot Spitzer: As of today (6 Nov. 2008), "(4)" (or at least the first part of it, in my suggested list of outcomes above) has turned out to be the case.

Custer Laststand said:
(4) He won't be charged with anything by the feds, in part because of (3), but they will turn their evidence over to the State of New York for prosecution because New York has a law (promoted and signed, ironically, by E.S. himself) under which it is a state crime to solicit for ************.

A story in today's New York Times, headlined "No Federal Charges Against Spitzer," reads, in part:

"The United States attorney in Manhattan, Michael J. Garcia, announced on Thursday afternoon that no federal charges will be filed against former Gov. Eliot Spitzer of New York, who resigned in March in a scandal over his role as a customer of a ************ ring."

.....2nd paragraph, which gives background, is cut....

"Federal prosecutors had been investigating whether Mr. Spitzer committed a crime known as structuring, or making payments in such a way as to conceal their purpose and source, by wiring money into a bank account controlled by the ************ ring." .... etc.

—Custer
 
Well, evidence is mounting that the outcome for Eliot Spitzer (erstwhile Governor of New York) is "possibility 5" (which includes "4," in part) among the suggested list of outcomes in my opening post for this thread. Except, the long delay in prosecution of Mr. Spitzer by the State of New York is not being attributed to anything. Rather, it simply isn't happening. Meanwhile, Ms. Gail Collins has graciously brought us up to date with her New York Times column of 22 April 2009 entitled "Forgive and Forget," for which the opening line is: "Should we forgive Eliot Spitzer?" She continues:

“New York’s most prominent disgraced public official is on a rehabilitation tour. Doing TV interviews, writing for Slate, confessing his sins on the cover of Newsweek.”

“And as a New Yorker, I am rather proud of the way this is going. You don’t see Eliot volunteering to appear on ‘I’m a Celebrity, Get Me Out of Here’ like some other ex-governors I could mention.”

…….. text deleted ……..

“Whatever he’s doing, it’s working. New York is pretty clearly ready to let Spitzer move on. Although he is not the most sympathetic personality in the world, as he’s re-emerged, new information keeps coming out that makes you feel a little warmer about him.”

…………. etc …………...

Perhaps the decreasingly-vindictive feelings toward Mr. Spitzer that seem evident among New Yorkers are related to their decreasing perception that his successor will be considered by historians to have been among New York's outstanding governors. But of course, that's only speculation....

—Custer
 

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