She Is His
- Thread starterSoonToBe
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Well, the just closed the door to the bedroom as Sue said she would like a little privacy after I watched them fuck quickly till she had a quick but good orgasm. He pulled out of her still hard and she came over to me and asked me if she could be alone with him. How could I say no. I'm going to go back upstairs and listen in - I didn't get a chance to masturbate watching them but I am quite horny right now obviously!
Paul left a little while ago and Sue's just gone into the shower so I have a few minutes. I don't know if it was intentional or not but the bedroom door was open this morning and it's the first time that I've watched them in the morning, I don't know if I've ever seen them together at that time. I walked by earlier and they were still asleep but when I went back up to the spare-bedroom while I was in there I heard them talking and realized they were up. I was going to make some noise or whatever but I heard her say "if you need to, okay" and I heard him reply but I wasn't able to make it out. I walked quietly to the crack in the door and I watched her lying on her back with her legs back for him. It seemed different than last night and I'm hard just typing this right now. What it seemed to me was her just letting him fuck her. .
I'll have to share more later but it's got me hard and horny again. That's on top of seeing him pull out of her while he was still fully hard last night. God that is so erotic to me to see him and see how far he is in her. Yes, I'll say it - where I used to be in her. God that just turns me on. We talked about that too and I told her so. But honestly - seeing him pull out of her and then seeing that big head on his cock come out still fully hard.
Okay - the shower just went off and I'll be honest - I want to go look at her as she gets dried off and gets dressed.
I'll have to share more later but it's got me hard and horny again. That's on top of seeing him pull out of her while he was still fully hard last night. God that is so erotic to me to see him and see how far he is in her. Yes, I'll say it - where I used to be in her. God that just turns me on. We talked about that too and I told her so. But honestly - seeing him pull out of her and then seeing that big head on his cock come out still fully hard.
Okay - the shower just went off and I'll be honest - I want to go look at her as she gets dried off and gets dressed.
SoonToBe said:
There's a certain irony that Sue wanted to get away from her sense of sexual obligation to Steve, i.e. letting him fuck her when he was horny even though she wasn't and yet here she is doing the same thing with Paul as it sounds like he was horny and had a need that she didn't....
LOL - Enigma - the difference is just as you said - I know while she may not necessarily really orgasm hard with him in the morning, there's no mistake that she wants it. She's already teased me about watching her yesterday morning. After Paul had left and she was ready for the day we took advantage of the lack-of-rain and went and took a hike/walk down to the lake and taking a long hike around it. We talked a bit as we walked and when we stopped. Actually it was when we stopped for a break that brought it up as she reached for a tissue in her backpack and made no secret of it as she reached into her panties with it and wiped herself - she smiled when she saw me watching her and she giggled and said "what?.... you know I like feeling him still in me...". She told me that was partly why she liked letting him have her in the morning like that, she giggled and said "it's not all just for him" (even if it looked that way).
But last night, well afternoon and evening we talked a bunch more and she shared some more of her feelings. Some of it was hard to hear and hurt or stung a bit but I'll share anyway.
She brought it up when she asked me again if I was okay about what she'd like to do with me. I asked her why she wanted to do it and she said some of what she's said already - that she says she wants to feel me again in her - but again cautioned me that she just wants to have a "little re-memory" as she put it and again said that all she wants is for me to be in her for just a few seconds at most. I asked her to tell me more and for the first time - she did.
She said that she would try to tell me what she's feeling and what she wants. It was one of those time when she felt like talking because she also told me more about how she feels having sex with Paul and how she knew I was watching. I asked her about the morning and she told me that she likes to feel him in her and she likes how it feels to have him cum in her. She described how it felt to wake up next to him and know that she was intimate with him and that she liked how it feels to be naked in bed and that as she wakes up and he touches her, that she remembers how she felt with him and, as I said, she was really in a talkative mood, and she said that she can feel herself responding without even thinking about it. She wasn't really looking at me as she talked which I know means she's really in the mood and she told me how she can feel her pussy start to get wet and she said that as she rolls over, that she can feel she's still wet inside from the night before and how that turns her on. What stung a bit but I also knew was the truth was when she said how natural and easy it feels to let him touch her and for her to feel his morning hardness. She turned to me and told me that it made her horny to feel that he's ready again for her and how she loved just "letting it happen" and how she doesn't need to feel turned on to want to feel him in her and she looked at me and said that she wants to be there for him and to "let him cum in me" and that it leaves her feeling good about herself and she giggled about him always being happy in the morning.
I told her it was really erotic to hear her tell me more about it and how it feels to her. And that was when she started to say stuff that I knew was coming but stung a bit nonetheless. She told me that is exactly what she's not ready for yet with me. She told me how she is just not ready to feel me in her that way like he is. I asked her to explain more. The way she said it is basically that she's not ready to feel me in her and to feel me "posessing her". I asked her what she meant and the only way she could explain it was to say that even though she has the pleasure, that having a big cock in her is still giving him some control over her. "Feeling him... or you.... you know... deep inside me.... " and she tried to say that when a guy is fucking her that he still exerts some level of posession or control over her. At one point she told me that "I'm just not ready to feel that from you yet" - she said that she's just not ready to feel me "take her" and to let me be way in her again - but she told me how she does want to feel that from Paul - "...you know... the feeling of being completely filled by him.... all the way back....". I think she lost a bit her thought there as she suddenly turned to me and said "I"m just not ready to feel you in me like that yet....". She said that having sex with Paul is just like I'd said - that she doesn't feel like a mom or a wife when she's with him. But she knows that if she just let me fuck her - (she said it just like that) - that she would have that same feeling. I asked (joked) with her about "how else can it be - I am your husband after all" and she said that it's not that. It's that she wants to take it slowly and to have me start out slowly - like we are - with me just in her for a little bit.
And then she said it - she said that she wanted to get back to where we were "like how you saw me with Paul baby" where they'd fuck for a little while and then he'd pull out of her and they'd take a break and then they'd get started again. I told her she could do that with me and her answer was a simple "not yet" and that she really truly feels she needs to take this as slowly as we can and that she wants us to get used to "re-introducing yourself to my body" in a way that the sex seems more even and not turning into "me satisyfing you again". I told her that I did know what she meant. And I shared some thoughts about "way back when" between us - where we'd spend a day in bed and fuck on/off all day. She looked at me and she said she too wanted that back - but she said that she doubted that I was ready for that either and that "given a chance, you'd want to fuck until you'd cum and... you know,.... that's kind of where we were....". I told her she was wrong but at the same time, I also know she's right. She looked at me and said "you need to change how you feel too" and she said that she can see it happening for me too " you being okay about not having sex with me is a huge step baby....." and she reminded me how while we did have that kind of crazy-all-day sex, that she also reminded me that there were a lot of times that we didn't have sex and how good things were because when we did "we both wanted it for each other, not just ourselves". She kissed me and said "it's just going to take some time honey... I know how I want to feel about and with you and I know that we'll be there baby....". She giggled and said that it'll be fun on Fathers' day to have some fun together and you know, just have you in me for a little bit....
After dinner last night we were sort of relaxing in the bedroom and she was telling me again how nice it was feeling between us. I told her it was and how crazy and surreal it felt to have now gone this long and to get past that "awkward point". She hugged me and told me how she thought this was good for us and that she loved me very much for all of this. I can't remember what I said, something about "when we do resume" and she said she too was thinking about that and how she wanted to feel that same kind of arousal she's feeling with Paul. I told her that it'll be nice when it's time for us. We hugged and she said "You know, it's going to be fun when we're both ready". It was a few minutes later she when she looked at me and said "are you okay with all this?" I told her honestly that I was. That it was something that turned me on to see happening to and with her and that I wanted us to come out in a better place where it's easier between us. She smiled and told me she loved me and that was what she wanted too. I guess it was maybe 15-20 mins later and the show we were absent-mindedly watching ended and she turned to me and seeming out of the blue she said "you know, it's not going to go back to the way it was baby...... you know that right?.....". I looked at her surprised at the return to our earlier conversation and I told her "no, I don't expect that.... I'm sure you'll have far more say in things...". She smiled and said "yes, exactly....". A moment later she said "I expect to always have a lover.... you know that... we talked about that....". I smiled back and said "yes, we did. I know. It'll be fine... " and then I added " I trust that we'll find the right balance". She giggled and said "I'm always going to deny you at times baby... I think you will probably always want that... Won't you?". It was a more serious question, to which I almost immediately answered "yes, pretty sure so..." and I giggled a bit to make sure she understood I wasn't upset at all. This was old news after all but I knew she wanted to hear it. And then she said it, "I still want you t use condoms baby...." I turned to look at her but didn't say anything "that's going to be the last part that we return to baby...." and then she said it "If we get back to that....". I looked at her and I guess my eyes opened wider but I still didn't say anything - I wasn't sure what to say but she continued as she looked at me and said "I need to feel a certain way before I want that with you baby...." and after a pause she continued and said "I need to want that from you again and I don't yet... I don't want to feel that from you yet..." and she seemed to continue talking and she said that she's not ready to feel me orgasm in her much less to it without a condom. I didn't know what to say as she continued and went back to some of what shed' said earlier - that feeling me get to orgasm inside her is something she's not ready to feel or share with me yet and that when she does, that it's going to be as she said, that it doesn't all just get to go back in place right away and that "if you get to cum inside me again, it's probably going to be the last thing that we get back to". She must have seen the look on my face because she hugged me and said "sorry baby, it's just something I feel. you... doing that.... you know... in me... " she paused and said "it's just not what I'm ready to feel with you just yet..... " and she said that right now it feels "just right" sharing that with just Paul and that it is really making her so much more aware of herself and her body. She looked at me and said "it may just be something for a special occasion if you know... you do get to cum inside me...." and she paused and then said "would that be okay... you know.... as a how it could be? ...." and after a pause she said "that'd really make me feel comfortable thinking more about it. I hugged her and I told her I loved her and that we could work anything out.
Well, felt good to get that out of my head before I couldn't recall details.
But last night, well afternoon and evening we talked a bunch more and she shared some more of her feelings. Some of it was hard to hear and hurt or stung a bit but I'll share anyway.
She brought it up when she asked me again if I was okay about what she'd like to do with me. I asked her why she wanted to do it and she said some of what she's said already - that she says she wants to feel me again in her - but again cautioned me that she just wants to have a "little re-memory" as she put it and again said that all she wants is for me to be in her for just a few seconds at most. I asked her to tell me more and for the first time - she did.
She said that she would try to tell me what she's feeling and what she wants. It was one of those time when she felt like talking because she also told me more about how she feels having sex with Paul and how she knew I was watching. I asked her about the morning and she told me that she likes to feel him in her and she likes how it feels to have him cum in her. She described how it felt to wake up next to him and know that she was intimate with him and that she liked how it feels to be naked in bed and that as she wakes up and he touches her, that she remembers how she felt with him and, as I said, she was really in a talkative mood, and she said that she can feel herself responding without even thinking about it. She wasn't really looking at me as she talked which I know means she's really in the mood and she told me how she can feel her pussy start to get wet and she said that as she rolls over, that she can feel she's still wet inside from the night before and how that turns her on. What stung a bit but I also knew was the truth was when she said how natural and easy it feels to let him touch her and for her to feel his morning hardness. She turned to me and told me that it made her horny to feel that he's ready again for her and how she loved just "letting it happen" and how she doesn't need to feel turned on to want to feel him in her and she looked at me and said that she wants to be there for him and to "let him cum in me" and that it leaves her feeling good about herself and she giggled about him always being happy in the morning.
I told her it was really erotic to hear her tell me more about it and how it feels to her. And that was when she started to say stuff that I knew was coming but stung a bit nonetheless. She told me that is exactly what she's not ready for yet with me. She told me how she is just not ready to feel me in her that way like he is. I asked her to explain more. The way she said it is basically that she's not ready to feel me in her and to feel me "posessing her". I asked her what she meant and the only way she could explain it was to say that even though she has the pleasure, that having a big cock in her is still giving him some control over her. "Feeling him... or you.... you know... deep inside me.... " and she tried to say that when a guy is fucking her that he still exerts some level of posession or control over her. At one point she told me that "I'm just not ready to feel that from you yet" - she said that she's just not ready to feel me "take her" and to let me be way in her again - but she told me how she does want to feel that from Paul - "...you know... the feeling of being completely filled by him.... all the way back....". I think she lost a bit her thought there as she suddenly turned to me and said "I"m just not ready to feel you in me like that yet....". She said that having sex with Paul is just like I'd said - that she doesn't feel like a mom or a wife when she's with him. But she knows that if she just let me fuck her - (she said it just like that) - that she would have that same feeling. I asked (joked) with her about "how else can it be - I am your husband after all" and she said that it's not that. It's that she wants to take it slowly and to have me start out slowly - like we are - with me just in her for a little bit.
And then she said it - she said that she wanted to get back to where we were "like how you saw me with Paul baby" where they'd fuck for a little while and then he'd pull out of her and they'd take a break and then they'd get started again. I told her she could do that with me and her answer was a simple "not yet" and that she really truly feels she needs to take this as slowly as we can and that she wants us to get used to "re-introducing yourself to my body" in a way that the sex seems more even and not turning into "me satisyfing you again". I told her that I did know what she meant. And I shared some thoughts about "way back when" between us - where we'd spend a day in bed and fuck on/off all day. She looked at me and she said she too wanted that back - but she said that she doubted that I was ready for that either and that "given a chance, you'd want to fuck until you'd cum and... you know,.... that's kind of where we were....". I told her she was wrong but at the same time, I also know she's right. She looked at me and said "you need to change how you feel too" and she said that she can see it happening for me too " you being okay about not having sex with me is a huge step baby....." and she reminded me how while we did have that kind of crazy-all-day sex, that she also reminded me that there were a lot of times that we didn't have sex and how good things were because when we did "we both wanted it for each other, not just ourselves". She kissed me and said "it's just going to take some time honey... I know how I want to feel about and with you and I know that we'll be there baby....". She giggled and said that it'll be fun on Fathers' day to have some fun together and you know, just have you in me for a little bit....
After dinner last night we were sort of relaxing in the bedroom and she was telling me again how nice it was feeling between us. I told her it was and how crazy and surreal it felt to have now gone this long and to get past that "awkward point". She hugged me and told me how she thought this was good for us and that she loved me very much for all of this. I can't remember what I said, something about "when we do resume" and she said she too was thinking about that and how she wanted to feel that same kind of arousal she's feeling with Paul. I told her that it'll be nice when it's time for us. We hugged and she said "You know, it's going to be fun when we're both ready". It was a few minutes later she when she looked at me and said "are you okay with all this?" I told her honestly that I was. That it was something that turned me on to see happening to and with her and that I wanted us to come out in a better place where it's easier between us. She smiled and told me she loved me and that was what she wanted too. I guess it was maybe 15-20 mins later and the show we were absent-mindedly watching ended and she turned to me and seeming out of the blue she said "you know, it's not going to go back to the way it was baby...... you know that right?.....". I looked at her surprised at the return to our earlier conversation and I told her "no, I don't expect that.... I'm sure you'll have far more say in things...". She smiled and said "yes, exactly....". A moment later she said "I expect to always have a lover.... you know that... we talked about that....". I smiled back and said "yes, we did. I know. It'll be fine... " and then I added " I trust that we'll find the right balance". She giggled and said "I'm always going to deny you at times baby... I think you will probably always want that... Won't you?". It was a more serious question, to which I almost immediately answered "yes, pretty sure so..." and I giggled a bit to make sure she understood I wasn't upset at all. This was old news after all but I knew she wanted to hear it. And then she said it, "I still want you t use condoms baby...." I turned to look at her but didn't say anything "that's going to be the last part that we return to baby...." and then she said it "If we get back to that....". I looked at her and I guess my eyes opened wider but I still didn't say anything - I wasn't sure what to say but she continued as she looked at me and said "I need to feel a certain way before I want that with you baby...." and after a pause she continued and said "I need to want that from you again and I don't yet... I don't want to feel that from you yet..." and she seemed to continue talking and she said that she's not ready to feel me orgasm in her much less to it without a condom. I didn't know what to say as she continued and went back to some of what shed' said earlier - that feeling me get to orgasm inside her is something she's not ready to feel or share with me yet and that when she does, that it's going to be as she said, that it doesn't all just get to go back in place right away and that "if you get to cum inside me again, it's probably going to be the last thing that we get back to". She must have seen the look on my face because she hugged me and said "sorry baby, it's just something I feel. you... doing that.... you know... in me... " she paused and said "it's just not what I'm ready to feel with you just yet..... " and she said that right now it feels "just right" sharing that with just Paul and that it is really making her so much more aware of herself and her body. She looked at me and said "it may just be something for a special occasion if you know... you do get to cum inside me...." and she paused and then said "would that be okay... you know.... as a how it could be? ...." and after a pause she said "that'd really make me feel comfortable thinking more about it. I hugged her and I told her I loved her and that we could work anything out.
Well, felt good to get that out of my head before I couldn't recall details.
Steve,
A lot of how Sue sees you both now and in the immediate past. Not all of it flattering to you but probably better that you have heard it. I can see now why Sue sees it is a staged way back.
Not much on exactly what Sue wants to feel herself unless she has actually revealed it to be a complete sexual absence of you. Which would make sense given what she said. I suspect that may be finally confirmed soon now. She has got the big message out.
I think it does emphasise both that Paul is no relationship threat and that Sue does truly love you. The fact that she is wanting to go to this extreme to repair something she sees as quite damaged shows that in quite stark detail.
I suspect you now need time to fully absorb her message. This isn't just a process that Sue is going through, it's really one that she is leading you through. A fact apparently not fully ******* until today. I'd take stock before moving again but when you do, make sure it's in the right direction.
A lot of how Sue sees you both now and in the immediate past. Not all of it flattering to you but probably better that you have heard it. I can see now why Sue sees it is a staged way back.
Not much on exactly what Sue wants to feel herself unless she has actually revealed it to be a complete sexual absence of you. Which would make sense given what she said. I suspect that may be finally confirmed soon now. She has got the big message out.
I think it does emphasise both that Paul is no relationship threat and that Sue does truly love you. The fact that she is wanting to go to this extreme to repair something she sees as quite damaged shows that in quite stark detail.
I suspect you now need time to fully absorb her message. This isn't just a process that Sue is going through, it's really one that she is leading you through. A fact apparently not fully ******* until today. I'd take stock before moving again but when you do, make sure it's in the right direction.
Peak - I get it what she wants to feel. I guess I can't explain it any more than she can but to put it in the most straight-forward way, she wants to get us back to a point where when we fuck - she doesn't feel like she's my wife or our kids mom - but that she's herself and that if she wants to fuck, it's because she wants to and not because I or someone else does. It's weird but I sort of get it. Her explanation of how she feels physically and how it makes her feel to have me in her was hard to hear - that she simply doesn't want to feel my fulfillment in her - that she wants it to be that she wants the sex and she wants the pleasure above giving it to me. It does sting as I said to hear her say it that way - that she wants to almost vacate 25+ years of sex between us to restore what she wants.
But at the same time I know she's right. It's weird to say it but I know what she's saying and I even admit it's somewhat my fault - although I think it's inevitable that a woman would feel like a wife and mom after all that's what she is. But I do know that maybe long ago - that when we fucked - yeah, I think maybe I did do it more for her than for me in some way. And I do have to say that Paul - is truly there to please her, not that I wasn't - but again, it's that whole how we feel together thing. So when she says she just wants me in her for a little bit - I know what she wants. She wants to feel me but not feel me if that makes any sense. She wants to build up - albeit very slowly - to the point where when I'm in her - it's about her excitement and her wanting me in there, not because I want it or need it. I get it. It stings because, well, it is her wanting to sort of erase that mom/wife feeling - I do get it though - doing without her sexually is giving me that same perspective she is having - seeing her like this now for so long, if anything, I guess it's made me respect her that much more.
But at the same time I know she's right. It's weird to say it but I know what she's saying and I even admit it's somewhat my fault - although I think it's inevitable that a woman would feel like a wife and mom after all that's what she is. But I do know that maybe long ago - that when we fucked - yeah, I think maybe I did do it more for her than for me in some way. And I do have to say that Paul - is truly there to please her, not that I wasn't - but again, it's that whole how we feel together thing. So when she says she just wants me in her for a little bit - I know what she wants. She wants to feel me but not feel me if that makes any sense. She wants to build up - albeit very slowly - to the point where when I'm in her - it's about her excitement and her wanting me in there, not because I want it or need it. I get it. It stings because, well, it is her wanting to sort of erase that mom/wife feeling - I do get it though - doing without her sexually is giving me that same perspective she is having - seeing her like this now for so long, if anything, I guess it's made me respect her that much more.
SoonToBe said:
Steve, perhaps a difficult question, but this sounds like Sue regrets having followed the mom/wife path, do you think that's really true?
Personally I think that she's trying to relive her youth (don't we all want to?) where she was free-er to do what she wanted when she wanted and with who she wanted
Steve,
First I'd just like to say thank you for sharing your posts of the last few days. It can't have been easy but sometimes writing it down helps to clarify it in your mind. Maybe sharing it helps in gaining the confidence to go forward too.
It sounds to me that Sue is trying to free herself from the Obligation of having to satisfy you, particularly that version of you that (maybe in her mind, maybe not) treated sex as something that led to your satisfaction and not necessarily totally hers. For a long time she wanted more from you and now she gets that from her lovers. Her love for you still meant that she wanted to make love with you, but you continued to want to fuck instead. Something that she discovered her lovers are in fact better at. So she limited your sex, then stopped it entirely. To me, she wants to restart it as something that gives her satisfaction as well as you, but that perhaps means you having to learn or relearn some techniques (or chemical help) to sustain your lovemaking over the time Sue now needs to get total satisfaction. It may be a slow process for both of you as it also requires Sue to get away from her obligation mind set too. Ingrained thinking requires time to overcome, in particular it will leave Sue hypersensitive to you appearing to think of yourself first. This would kill or reduce substantially her passion for you at that moment, a difficult thing to come back from (pun intended). Her saying it at the time would of course kill your passion, something the chemical help might assist in overcoming (again). Not an easy situation to recovery from for either of you, but one which with your mutual love you should manage in time.
First I'd just like to say thank you for sharing your posts of the last few days. It can't have been easy but sometimes writing it down helps to clarify it in your mind. Maybe sharing it helps in gaining the confidence to go forward too.
It sounds to me that Sue is trying to free herself from the Obligation of having to satisfy you, particularly that version of you that (maybe in her mind, maybe not) treated sex as something that led to your satisfaction and not necessarily totally hers. For a long time she wanted more from you and now she gets that from her lovers. Her love for you still meant that she wanted to make love with you, but you continued to want to fuck instead. Something that she discovered her lovers are in fact better at. So she limited your sex, then stopped it entirely. To me, she wants to restart it as something that gives her satisfaction as well as you, but that perhaps means you having to learn or relearn some techniques (or chemical help) to sustain your lovemaking over the time Sue now needs to get total satisfaction. It may be a slow process for both of you as it also requires Sue to get away from her obligation mind set too. Ingrained thinking requires time to overcome, in particular it will leave Sue hypersensitive to you appearing to think of yourself first. This would kill or reduce substantially her passion for you at that moment, a difficult thing to come back from (pun intended). Her saying it at the time would of course kill your passion, something the chemical help might assist in overcoming (again). Not an easy situation to recovery from for either of you, but one which with your mutual love you should manage in time.
So - I guess I should clarify some things - as she reminded me last night too. While we were getting into our usual Wednesday fun she started to ask me questions that I knew were meant to help us talk more but also to get me turned on. I know she saw me grow rock hard as we talked when she asked me if I "... remembered how it felt to cum inside me...?". And when I started to answer she reminded me of what I already knew, that it's been almost a year since I had one of the few times she let me go last year without a condom - and it felt weird to actually tell her no - that I really don't have the vivid memory of how it feels to let go while I was in her bare. We talked more and she said that it was important to her that we both got to that point.
I asked her honestly, in a way stemming from replies and PM's here, that she's not doing without that and she giggled and said that it's about me and not Paul. I told her, I guess it's how it sounded, that I was sorry that I'd made her feel this "obligation" - and it was her response that made me feel better and she said that she knows that and that's not what is making her want this now, she doesn't feel she's getting even with me or even anything like that. I said something like "huh?" and I asked her what she meant and she said that it's because she recognizes what she missed out on with past lovers - that putting it simply (instead of trying to recant everythign) - that when I came out as wanting to try/be beta - that as she felt more and more comfortable with Paul - that she says she knew what she wanted to work towards. I asked her if she'd hoped we'd try what we're doing now - me abstaining with her - back when she first started to ask me to use condoms. She slowly nodded yes and then said that she didn't think we'd actually get to this point but she said that she did have some fantasies about what could happen.
Now I don't know how much of this she's created to fill in things but it surprised me as I thought from how she'd shared with me before that there was some animosity towards me regarding this "obligation" feeling she says she's had - but she seemed to say no, which is something I don't think I"ve fully digested just yet.
I can't explain it but it felt like there was suddenly some more clarity between us. I don't know if maybe I'd missed some of this before or was it more of what I was thinking in response to what she'd said than actually what she'd said? But essentially, her getting into Paul simply led to everything. I guess, had he been different or had she not enjoyed him as she is and has been, that maybe none of this would have happened? Or would it have just happened a bit later on with maybe someone else? All I can say is that I felt strangely calm after this talk with her rather than anxious as I had thought it would end - which made for a very enjoyable evening.
I asked her honestly, in a way stemming from replies and PM's here, that she's not doing without that and she giggled and said that it's about me and not Paul. I told her, I guess it's how it sounded, that I was sorry that I'd made her feel this "obligation" - and it was her response that made me feel better and she said that she knows that and that's not what is making her want this now, she doesn't feel she's getting even with me or even anything like that. I said something like "huh?" and I asked her what she meant and she said that it's because she recognizes what she missed out on with past lovers - that putting it simply (instead of trying to recant everythign) - that when I came out as wanting to try/be beta - that as she felt more and more comfortable with Paul - that she says she knew what she wanted to work towards. I asked her if she'd hoped we'd try what we're doing now - me abstaining with her - back when she first started to ask me to use condoms. She slowly nodded yes and then said that she didn't think we'd actually get to this point but she said that she did have some fantasies about what could happen.
Now I don't know how much of this she's created to fill in things but it surprised me as I thought from how she'd shared with me before that there was some animosity towards me regarding this "obligation" feeling she says she's had - but she seemed to say no, which is something I don't think I"ve fully digested just yet.
I can't explain it but it felt like there was suddenly some more clarity between us. I don't know if maybe I'd missed some of this before or was it more of what I was thinking in response to what she'd said than actually what she'd said? But essentially, her getting into Paul simply led to everything. I guess, had he been different or had she not enjoyed him as she is and has been, that maybe none of this would have happened? Or would it have just happened a bit later on with maybe someone else? All I can say is that I felt strangely calm after this talk with her rather than anxious as I had thought it would end - which made for a very enjoyable evening.
Mmm, it seems strange Steve that you took the line that Sue may have been annoyed at you with her feelings of obligation. My reading of what you wrote was that those feelings were something she put on herself, and that you taking advantage by getting yourself off without fully satisfying her sometimes was not the main issue. It meant that a solution had to come from Sue and her actions not you and yours. Having fixed it Sue will be in a position with you and her lovers where she will be fully able to communicate what she wants, and will expect to get it. Hence your need to step up your game. As she puts it, it seems unlikely that you will ever be able to fully satisfy her so another lover will remain part of the solution. Once fixed though, Sue will want some of that satisfaction from you, perhaps as much as you are able to in fact, but it must now be at the standard she expects and knows you can deliver when you want to.
To me this balance works well with your continuing need for some denial. By not giving you every chance to make love and by blatantly fucking others in your presence she is clearly denying you at the same time as satisfying you elsewhere. It is vital that you realise though that these will not be the mercy fucks of old. Her obligations where you came and she didn't fully, but real equal to her lovers encounters with the man she loves. I don't think the New Sue will settle for anything less. You shouldn't either.
To me this balance works well with your continuing need for some denial. By not giving you every chance to make love and by blatantly fucking others in your presence she is clearly denying you at the same time as satisfying you elsewhere. It is vital that you realise though that these will not be the mercy fucks of old. Her obligations where you came and she didn't fully, but real equal to her lovers encounters with the man she loves. I don't think the New Sue will settle for anything less. You shouldn't either.
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Peak - no I didn't mean it that way entirely but merely that I still feel that ultimately I share in some of that - I mean I guess in some ways I should have been more understanding of what she would have wanted rather than what I felt I needed. But yes, as she continues to share herself with me regarding this sort of stuff, I do see what she's getting at and whether she blames me, I feel I share some. Maybe that's part of what has given me some of the drive for what I've wanted or needed to give up. Could it be that i either influenced her in wanting this? Or perhaps I may have felt or somehow subconsciously figured this out about her and my newfound beta desire is really a way to help her?
She knows I am excited to resume any kind of sex with her but at the same time, we are both very aware that this will be at her pace and yes, I don't think there's a worry that I'll be there to participate! Whether I can satisfy her newfound sexual desire and appetite - that really doesn't matter to me as much as us being good in the long term and her being able to enjoy sex with me the way she wants to - for herself and not necessarily for me.
For now though, she's quite content to enjoy Paul even if he annoys her - I think while it annoys her it also keeps her in check a bit that he has again asked her to wait till Saturday evening to come by instead of what she'd hoped would be to see him tonight.
She knows I am excited to resume any kind of sex with her but at the same time, we are both very aware that this will be at her pace and yes, I don't think there's a worry that I'll be there to participate! Whether I can satisfy her newfound sexual desire and appetite - that really doesn't matter to me as much as us being good in the long term and her being able to enjoy sex with me the way she wants to - for herself and not necessarily for me.
For now though, she's quite content to enjoy Paul even if he annoys her - I think while it annoys her it also keeps her in check a bit that he has again asked her to wait till Saturday evening to come by instead of what she'd hoped would be to see him tonight.
SoonToBe said:
Steve, don't beat your self up about it, as you well know one of the secrets of a good relationship/marriage is communication.
If back then there was an issue that you couldn't see then Sue could / should have been at least dropping hints.
I could understand her not saying anything if you were very Dom and she was very sub to you, and but I get the impression that back then you were probably pretty equal, and that at times you were showing your beta side already.
I still think that Sue is being a little unfair, as I commented above she's saying that she felt an obligation to let you have sex when you were horny and she wasn't, yet she continues this behaviour with Paul particularly in the mornings. Yes, I get that she enjoys it, particularly afterwards, but I bet that she was actually the same with you in the past but that part has been conveniently forgotten
To be honest it reads more as if you are using possible past behaviour as an excuse / explanation for what is happening now - This is not a criticism more an observation
Enigma - yeah, you are right - I'm just doing the mental math about it and what I might have done or felt differently back then that may have changed things - or maybe they wouldn't have. I'm not so sure also that it wasn't that she didn't enjoy the sex with me - I mean she's not one to fake orgasms (and they're kind of hard to hide - so I know she climaxed with me). I think it was more that in hindsight, that she would have preferred to do as we began to do later on - where she would be open and honest with me afterwards and tell me that she would prefer I waited. I understand her wanting to enjoy what I can only describe as the 'afterglow' of having been with another man - and that I can understand how it might have felt for her to have felt that sort of obligation to take care of me. So yes - our being more equals back then would have also led to this. I'm not begrudging anything either - indeed I am still quite sexually satisfied right now - but I also admit that I know there is something missing between us and that I'm confident it will return in some ways between us.
We've talked only briefly but I've been thinking a lot about what she's said about re-introducing me slowly to her sexually. I do get it - I mean I know that if we did have sex - that I can almost understand her thoughts about not wanting to feel me that way. She hasn't felt that with me now in over 5 months and I know how I am when I am about to cum - I thrust really deep in and I love to be deep when I cum - that much I do remember!!!! And I can honestly understand her not wanting to feel that with me just yet. I can almost be in her head where she feels torn between what I assume would be some arousal between us - and then at the end - to feel me relieving myself - I know she's not ready to share that moment with me as I do get it - that she can't fully release with me just yet and in the end, I can almost see how she'd feel it was just more of how it used to be - that if she's not totally into it, that all it is, I guess, is really me sort of using her to masturbate - I mean of course I'd want to pleasure her - but if she's not able to get into it mentally yet - then surely feeling me pounding against the back of her vagina until I cum will not be a good thing for her.
I will say - and this is going to sound crazy - but I am glad that she wants to maintain some level of denial with me. It feels so weird but I actually agree with her desire for me to keep using condoms with her. Now that she's brought it up that it will be one of the last things to return between us - me having her bare - it just feels right to me. I feel crazy saying this but I do think its something I almost need to have with her as long as I'm still feeling beta. I don't know if that makes any sense - but I do so remember the feeling of fulfillment using condoms with her last year that if that is what we return to, or if that's the interim step along the long term, then it's weird to say that I"m actually kind of excited by the idea.
We've talked only briefly but I've been thinking a lot about what she's said about re-introducing me slowly to her sexually. I do get it - I mean I know that if we did have sex - that I can almost understand her thoughts about not wanting to feel me that way. She hasn't felt that with me now in over 5 months and I know how I am when I am about to cum - I thrust really deep in and I love to be deep when I cum - that much I do remember!!!! And I can honestly understand her not wanting to feel that with me just yet. I can almost be in her head where she feels torn between what I assume would be some arousal between us - and then at the end - to feel me relieving myself - I know she's not ready to share that moment with me as I do get it - that she can't fully release with me just yet and in the end, I can almost see how she'd feel it was just more of how it used to be - that if she's not totally into it, that all it is, I guess, is really me sort of using her to masturbate - I mean of course I'd want to pleasure her - but if she's not able to get into it mentally yet - then surely feeling me pounding against the back of her vagina until I cum will not be a good thing for her.
I will say - and this is going to sound crazy - but I am glad that she wants to maintain some level of denial with me. It feels so weird but I actually agree with her desire for me to keep using condoms with her. Now that she's brought it up that it will be one of the last things to return between us - me having her bare - it just feels right to me. I feel crazy saying this but I do think its something I almost need to have with her as long as I'm still feeling beta. I don't know if that makes any sense - but I do so remember the feeling of fulfillment using condoms with her last year that if that is what we return to, or if that's the interim step along the long term, then it's weird to say that I"m actually kind of excited by the idea.
Well Steve, I can see how recent events have conspired to increase your contentidness. Just keep it in mind that your denial feelings and Sue's wanting to deny you are NOT in fact linked. That when she finally starts to slowly switch back to you, she is expecting you to switch back to her. The thing is, she will have thought about it for weeks or even months before making the decision to start. You may find out on very short notice so get ready to react in the right way.
I still suspect the golf week will end up representing the high water mark of Sue's relationship with Paul. High due to the day after day sex and attention of her solely on him, but high also because of what he sees it as. A GOLF week. With Sue as a bonus. Not the other way round. I suspect this realisation will finally mean Sue starts the fading of Super Paul after it. I just wonder whether she will transition to you or search for another lover as her priority after.
Now is certainly not the right moment but I suspect that after she has digested the reality of her time away, then will be the time to ask how she sees the timetable for the transition.
I still suspect the golf week will end up representing the high water mark of Sue's relationship with Paul. High due to the day after day sex and attention of her solely on him, but high also because of what he sees it as. A GOLF week. With Sue as a bonus. Not the other way round. I suspect this realisation will finally mean Sue starts the fading of Super Paul after it. I just wonder whether she will transition to you or search for another lover as her priority after.
Now is certainly not the right moment but I suspect that after she has digested the reality of her time away, then will be the time to ask how she sees the timetable for the transition.
Steve - As we mature and open ourselves up to our partner (spouse) while also setting aside our own ego's we can better listen and understand each other. This is something that you are Sue are able to do at this point. Your relationship is a success as you both are doing what many couple do not do at this stage of life as your continuing to develop better ways to communication and allowing each other to be your truest selves. It is amazing how many couples divorce when they enter the phase of empty nesting as the children become adults and move out.
As to the Golf week trip with Paul; I have a different take than some do. Golf is a hobby for some people (men/women), Golf is a business necessity for others (men/women), and I do not remember you mentioning through your post what Paul does for a living. I have many friends (men/women, husbands/wives) which Golf for a variety of reasons, some Golf together as a couple, some Golf with friends etc. Sue could always find a way to join Paul and his Golf buddies on the trip, Sue could always find a way to join the other women which may be on the trip or if she is the only woman on the trip she could always encourage Paul to arrange SPA time equal to his Golf time. This is not uncommon on professional/business trips when you have a plus1 on the trip.
As Peak suggested, when or if Sue does transition from Paul as her attraction to him fads, it will be interesting to see if Sue transitions back to you or if she simply begins her search for another lover as her priority/preferred afterwards. I am sure that Sue will reflect following her trip as Peak suggested although I believe in many ways she has continued to reflect on her respective relationships (you and Sue, Sue and Paul) after each mile stone over the years.
Continue to enjoy yourself and the ever evolving relationship with Sue and Paul.
As to the Golf week trip with Paul; I have a different take than some do. Golf is a hobby for some people (men/women), Golf is a business necessity for others (men/women), and I do not remember you mentioning through your post what Paul does for a living. I have many friends (men/women, husbands/wives) which Golf for a variety of reasons, some Golf together as a couple, some Golf with friends etc. Sue could always find a way to join Paul and his Golf buddies on the trip, Sue could always find a way to join the other women which may be on the trip or if she is the only woman on the trip she could always encourage Paul to arrange SPA time equal to his Golf time. This is not uncommon on professional/business trips when you have a plus1 on the trip.
As Peak suggested, when or if Sue does transition from Paul as her attraction to him fads, it will be interesting to see if Sue transitions back to you or if she simply begins her search for another lover as her priority/preferred afterwards. I am sure that Sue will reflect following her trip as Peak suggested although I believe in many ways she has continued to reflect on her respective relationships (you and Sue, Sue and Paul) after each mile stone over the years.
Continue to enjoy yourself and the ever evolving relationship with Sue and Paul.
You guys all have valid points and as I said, I believe that as long as she, playfully or for 'real', continues to deny me - or play with that - that I will surely be there for her more eager than ever.
A part of me is eager from anticipating this. I will sound crazy but I may share this thought, that perhaps we do try to fulfill her New Years resolution and - well a part of me is thinking maybe timing it so this coming New Years is when she would let me reach orgasm in and with her. It's such an intense thought right now to know that I haven't been intimate with her in so long now much less the last time I felt her bare and surely the last time she let me cum in her is now, if I remember correctly, coming up on a year ago. The thought and excitement - yes - there is excitement there - of rediscovering her is really starting to make more sense to me. I see the way she will move softly and slowly with him as he slides his hand down her panties and I know how excited she feels. The time for us to rediscover that will really be incredible so I do really understand her desire in that sense - to not "know" how I feel.
Yes, I know the risks - maybe it won't feel that way. But at the same time, I know how she seems to watch my cock and I'm taking more notice of that sort of stuff so I am quite sure she hasn't lost her desires.
She just left as he was due home by now and she plans to have dinner with him. She did leave me a nice dinner here and we did share some really nice time together earlier today so I do feel "up" right now. I'm sure the empty bed at 2am will remind me of reality much less the quietness in the house before then.
More later.
A part of me is eager from anticipating this. I will sound crazy but I may share this thought, that perhaps we do try to fulfill her New Years resolution and - well a part of me is thinking maybe timing it so this coming New Years is when she would let me reach orgasm in and with her. It's such an intense thought right now to know that I haven't been intimate with her in so long now much less the last time I felt her bare and surely the last time she let me cum in her is now, if I remember correctly, coming up on a year ago. The thought and excitement - yes - there is excitement there - of rediscovering her is really starting to make more sense to me. I see the way she will move softly and slowly with him as he slides his hand down her panties and I know how excited she feels. The time for us to rediscover that will really be incredible so I do really understand her desire in that sense - to not "know" how I feel.
Yes, I know the risks - maybe it won't feel that way. But at the same time, I know how she seems to watch my cock and I'm taking more notice of that sort of stuff so I am quite sure she hasn't lost her desires.
She just left as he was due home by now and she plans to have dinner with him. She did leave me a nice dinner here and we did share some really nice time together earlier today so I do feel "up" right now. I'm sure the empty bed at 2am will remind me of reality much less the quietness in the house before then.
More later.
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