She Is His

[SquirmingSub]

LOL - for sure she's the alpha right now in our triangle.

I'm kind of getting on edge as she's started to tell me more about her trip - and how it felt to "be his" for so long. She knew it would turn me on but I also totally felt that she didn't dump it all on me either so I'm anticipating more details as this week goes by.

One thing that has me perturbed right now is that after letting me see her when she got changed when she got home, she's kept to wearing panties since then - including to bed last night and this morning, she kept a towel around her waist till she pulled a pair on underneath it. I asked her what was up and she said that she "just wants to prolong the feeling" and she asked me if it was okay if she kept them on for the next few days. I was kind of speechless but I nodded yes and she proceeded to carry on as normal only instead of putting her makeup on naked in front of the mirror, she had panties on. I know she saw me looking and I did tell her that I missed seeing her naked. She just smiled back at me.

What she has shared is what she'd said to me before she'd left. That she wanted to "fuck a lot" and she confirmed they did. I did ask about the 9 times and she smiled and said that she'd lost count of how many times she orgasmed with him but did say that they fucked a lot of times when just she came and he didn't. She said she loved how it felt to be treated like that - she said it was so nice that he made her feel so good without expecting to always cum in her. I told her that it probably just made him hornier for the next time and she said "yes, that was the point".

Steve,

Thank you for the confirmation that you believe that Sue is the alpha right now in your respective relationship triangle as it current is. This does work for more couples than would actually admit to it. Some men cannot handle having a wife or even a woman as the clear alpha and those same men will tend to critic relationships which have embraced this type of arrangement.

You mentioned that you were on edge when Sue began to share details about her trip and what it truly felt like to ‘belong to Paul, to be his’ for the extended trip. If Sue felt this rising discomfort it would explain why she may have held back from completely share her experiences and feelings about the experience. Even your word ‘dump’ sounds a bit defensive, sounds as if maybe you are very uncomfortable with what she has been sharing with you and that you’re not as receptive as she might have hoped. Maybe she will share more with you as she believes you have become more receptive to the information. This type of exploration is not for every couple, and not every couple can handle the experience of being apart with the inclusion of another partner within the triad.

As we look at your experiences with forms of denial; you mentioned that you’re perturbed. Were you actually expecting that Sue would welcome a sexual reclaiming of sorts on her return home from the trip away with Paul? Many of your follower are not a fan of the denial while others are very much into the denial, some of made suggestions about chastity devices, others have suggest that any form of denial is bad. Personally I believe that you and Sue should be on the same page and do what works best for both of you either with or without the inclusions of another person (man/woman) within the relationship arrangement.

You are describing a form of extended denial that you have described in the past, the difference being now it would seem that on some level you are feeling that uncomfortable gray blurred area in between the seemingly clear lines which seems to be raising some concerns within you. In many ways it would seem that Sue is attempting to be sexual exclusive with Paul (with your encouragement) and it would seem that her goal is to feel as if she belongs to Paul as a monogamous women which in my opinion does involved a level of emotional connection that neither you or Sue would openly admit to. While you are her husband, you are truly no longer her sexual partner, yes she has given you a taste on father’s day of what is no longer yours, and yes for that one day you were the ‘other’ man not her primary sexual partner.

Sue keeping her panties on, restricting you from seeing ‘her’ completely naked is something she has done before and it is in its own way a form of denial, a form of keeping herself for her primary sexual partner Paul. While she may have told you that that she "just wants to prolong the feeling" and she asked you if it was okay if she kept them on for the next few days. This has been something she has done before and does seem natural for her within the progression of your triad arrangement. Sue may have reached that point of where she will prefer to only be completely naked with Paul. I am sure this is an unintended consequence of your encouragement of her to see Paul as her primary sexual partner. She knows that you miss seeing her naked and that is ok with her and should be with you at this point if you truly do see her as your alpha and Paul as her primary sexual partner.

Sue is also telling you something that every husband, every sexual partner should know and understand. It is not about one person or another, is not about a man simply getting himself off, Sue has told you before that she does not like feeling as if a man is masturbating within her, she wants to feel as if that man is making love to her, putting her pleasure before his own. Sue has pointed out in her own way that she likes to be the center of the attention, ideally in her scenario she enjoys having multiple orgasms before her sexual partner takes his own tern to release. Most men are selfish and do not realize this, those that do release it tend to make much better long term lovers. As you have said, she said to you that she loved how it felt to be treated like that - she said it was so nice that he made her feel so good without expecting to always cum in her. This is something that most experienced type beta men have evolved to understand, and not ever alpha man truly understands; it is good that Paul seems to understand how to truly enjoy women, a sexual partner, through making sure that she is completely satisfied before he takes his own turn to have a physical release of his own.

While she may never again see you as an alpha, she may see you as an equal in the future if you make the choice to put away your beta desires although you will need to put the constant need to have a physical orgasmic release aside for the sake of reconnecting with Sue from time to time. Learn to have intimacy, sexual and non-sexual, learn to be able to have intercourse without having a physical release; it cannot continue to be your focus if you want Sue to be the center of your world. I can tell you from my own personal experience, my current wife has more orgasmic releases in a month than I do in a year and no I do not currently use a chastity device as some of your following do. With that said, your body will learn to have an orgasmic release without a physical release and Sue will appreciate you even more for it. Yes I know, many of your followers will actually flame me for this posted reply.

SS

 

[SoonToBe]

Squirm - I'm with you where you overlap with Peak and others. If/when the sex does return between us, I surely have different views on it now than I did - both as still feeling beta but also now with a lot more knowledge of her. I'll be passionate and loving when needed, that's never been in doubt. But you all are assuming things about her that I don't know to be true just yet. Your assumption of her desiring me as an equal in terms of delivering pleasure and focus and attention, yes, absolutely, but my thought and feeling right now is that she is going to, likely for the long term, remain the alpha between us and surely will always be the determiner of if and when we have sex moving forward.

I still think a lot of you don't see what I see - that she likes denying me and for as long as she has a lover, I pretty much now know that I will likely always be denied in that way - where a lover will provide that "something different" and possibly still rooted in a desire to please me, that she will continue denying me as much as she feels she can and wants to.

It feels crazy to say it but I am aroused by that thought, that perhaps I will never be seen or perhaps wanted as an equal. I believe she understands that this isn't something negative or a criticism about her but more something inside me that I feel just as one person does or doesn't like fish or brussel sprouts.

I suppose a question could be - what does she want. Does she want me to be this way or would she prefer me as an alpha partner? I honestly believe she has had a lot of having an alpha partner and that she herself wants to enjoy that role right now. And I thoroughly believe that while she loves me with every inch of herself - the part between her legs isn't quite in that same place - and if this past weekend is anything to show for it, it was her that wanted it as much as he did. I honestly love that she knows she can enjoy that and she knows that I am okay with it.

She hasn't shared a lot yet - well she has, but just bits and pieces. Last night she took time to tell me of a brief conversation she had while on her trip. Apparently she joined some of the other ladies on the trip in the sauna. As she was the last to arrive, others left before her and when it was just her and one other woman, the other woman commented on her being totally bare and Sue said that all the other women had a least some pubic hair if not near full bushes. She said she was honest and answered the question by saying "Paul likes it that way". I knew Paul was fairly skilled at golf and it made me laugh as she shared some of the conversation that the other husbands had all told their wives that Paul's good scores were from him having sex with Sue in the morning before he goes off to the course. Apparently she's referred to as his "good luck charm". Sue said she giggled but didn't bat an eye as she told this other woman how "he likes it that way" (in the morning) to which she said the other woman answered "I wish my husband did".

Of course that was only part of it as she then teased me till I exploded for her as she told me how she thought the woman was going to ask about why her pussy was perhaps a bit more swollen or - as she teased and teased about - that she was worried she was actually leaking a bit as it wasn't that much earlier that Paul had enjoyed her! Hearing her tell me how she felt after they'd had sex and then how she'd had this conversation afterwards was very erotic. She told me that when the other woman left and she was alone in the sauna how she had to be sure to sit on her towel to not leave any wet-spots!

 

[SquirmingSub]

Steve - thank you for your reply. Sounds like you and Sue are on a positive path overall. It is truly a matter of being in sync with your respective desires and preferences. It does seem that Sue connects well socially with Paul's group of friends, and wives.

 

[SoonToBe]

I have liked that she's felt more comfortable telling me more about her feelings, almost in some ways, in place of actual things she did. What she has shared - and goes back to her wearing panties - is that she really did let herself feel that she was his partner for the whole time. Not partner in terms of replacing me - but very much so for the trip. She said it really let her let go of everything after the first day and then two went by. She said sex with him was amazing and felt even better "knowing" she would be with him for more time.

I am clear that they surely share pillow-talk and that there is more than just sex between them at times. But at the same time, I do believe her when she tells me she's not lying there telling her how much she loves him or anything like that. So it was exciting for her to tell me how sexy she felt at knowing he would be available to her whenever she wanted. It was more than just that, she told me how she liked how she felt after having sex with him that she could relax and enjoy how she felt instead of him running off or her having to run home. I talked to her pretty openly about it and I was honest and told her that I'd jerked off many times to thoughts of her with him and what they were likely doing together. She cooed and giggled when I told her of my thoughts about her pussy being wet from him the whole time. She talked to me a lot about that and why it turned me on. It was hard for me to explain it other than knowing as she'd already said, that it truly evidenced that she was his for the whole time. She asked me somewhat rhetorically if "it's that he gets to cum in me and you don't" and I nodded my head and said yes.

She lay next to me in just her panties as we talked after I'd jerked off and cleaned up. I told her that it made me crazy that she had them on and she giggled and we talked more openly than we had in a long time. I told her that knowing her most intimate places and most intimate feelings were now shared and even given to Paul was still something that turned me on. And I said it, I told her I hoped that she wasn't disappointed in me for that or that. As I shared earlier, she told me that for right now, she likes how things are and that she still wants to be very slow.

Ugh - I need to end this right now as I have a call from work to be on. More later or tomorrow.

 

[ShadowCuck]

Steve,

When you write about Sue and you not being equals, what all does that encompass, at least in your mind or desires? Is is just in terms of her calling all of the shots sexually, meaning that no matter how much you might want any kind of sex at any given moment, you don’t get to make a request that is owed a yes under any circumstances, with no relationship repercussions allowed to come from you, or is there more to the inequality?

 

[peakmb]

Steve,
It seems that others are picking up on the inconsistencies between what you report Sue as saying and what you interpret Sue as meaning. It all seems to hinge on what you are actually experiencing and what Sue wants to happen going forward.

There is currently a happy balance between Sue wanting separation from you to be with Paul and you being happy to be without a sexual partner and being happy with your masturbation, supervised or otherwise. As Sue is in charge, and Sue has said that at some point in the future she wants this balance to change, change is inevitable.

You talk of your denial in several different ways. Sometimes as if it is imposed on you by Sue as some sort of control, sometimes as if it is your idea that Sue has picked up on and maybe expanded, and sometimes as something you have secretly lusted for a long time and are now enjoying to the fullest extent possible. If indeed this last one is your true driver at the moment, then denial is not even the right word. You are enjoying exactly what you doing. The key axis here is your desire. If the former is true, then your primary desire is being held down by Sue and could be reignited by her simply stopping the denial. If the latter, it can only be reversed by you deciding that you want to enjoy even a limited sex life with Sue.

You have said many times and in several different ways that you will be ready for Sue when she wishes to re-engage sexually with you. You have not said for several years now that any of that indication would originate with you. If indeed you were to say that you desired to re-engage sexually with Sue, and she said no, or not yet then that would indeed be denial. It could even be that Sue would enjoy perhaps seeing that pain of thwarted desire in eyes and would tease you all the more until she was ready herself. Sue doesn’t see this though, because it isn’t there. Sue enjoys your ‘denial’ at present simply because it gives her what she wants with Paul. She is slowly but steadily getting deeper into this relationship, now being acknowledged by his friends and colleagues as his partner. Surely, some of those wives must have asked Sue if she was married and what her relationship is with you? What do you think she would have replied when they did? What will she say on the next trip, and the one after that?

If it is your plan to continue to treat Sue as mere fuel for your masturbation sessions, then that is fine. It’s your life and I really don’t want to try to interfere (in spite of what others may think). I do think if you continue to treat Sue this way, she will increasingly turn away from you but that is something you must realize and will have to handle.

If, on the other hand, you wish in the coming months to start to re-engage with Sue, then it will have to start with you, and not her. You will have to express your desire and risk having Sue reject it or delay it. I’m certain now she will do at least that to test whether you really mean it. You have reported her as saying again and again that when you are ready, you must say so. At the same time you repeat that you will respond when she starts it. This gap is starting to become a gulf and will only get bigger over time. Use it or lose it. Nor your dick but your desire. It will die if you don’t.

 

[SoonToBe]

Well, I think I can dispel many conjectures here because last night we both sort of came out and talked about what we both wanted and didn't want for the foreseeable future - we both agreed that "foreseeable" was perhaps a year to a year and half at a time. Neither of us thought we could predict our feelings or desires beyond that point.

I went first and I'll try to keep at summarized but share enough details that people don't go off onto conspiracy-theories or drive off the gloom-and-doom pier. This was perhaps a 40-45 minute discussion.

I told her that there were things that I was feeling and wanted to be more clear about and understand. I told her that I would always want and desire her sexually but I also was clear and said that (as we all know) I need to be denied somehow, someway, something, that it seemed to me that I was (and am still) most sexually satisfied when she denies me something sexually. I told her that whether it was merely being told "no" for 2 days before she used to go out on a date to where we are now, where our sexual contact is highly limited and more one-sided - that I felt somewhere in-between these 2 ends was what I found to be most satisfying.

I told her that I loved my Fathers Day surprise and that if/when we do resume sex more frequently, that I hoped to take into account all I've learned and listened to from her regarding my sensitivities towards her desires. But I did make it clear that I did want to resume some sort of sexual interaction with her - again - during the foreseeable future. I told her that even if it was just infrequent intercourse as this may have been, that as long as it was honest between us and intended to be pleasurable and re-connecting for us (as opposed to me just getting her off or as others here echoed, nor my masturbating in her) - that even infrequent would be okay with me.

She asked me more - along what we'd talked about before/earlier - that she wanted to understand more how I felt about everything. I told her that not having her had only made me want her more in some ways and to be even happier with what we do share. She admitted that things are really easy and comfortable between us and she agreed that limiting sex between us has made it easier for the both of us to learn more about ourselves. I told her again how it somehow turned me on intensely to share her sexually with Paul or other men and to know "that part" of her isn't just for me and I told her how part of this is that it's her that wants it, not just because it turns me on, but because it turns her on. She smiled and said that it most definitely turns her on. I told her honestly that I loved seeing or just knowing she's been sexual with Paul and that it only made me feel good to see or hear of her enjoying it. And I told her as I already had, that while it hurt at times when she was away, that it also turned me on incredibly that she was literally with him for so long. I reminded her that it had always turned me on to know she was sexual with others and she giggled and said she remembered well. Before the conversation moved to her taking the lead, I shared that seeing her naked - or not as is the case right now (she said she'll go back to being naked this weekend more around me but not yet) made me very aware of her body and that she chooses to share it only with Paul and that it made me feel amazingly horny to see "and yet not touch" her. She giggled and smiled.

And then she took the lead and she said that she loved hearing what I'd shared and that knowing I felt I could talk to her honestly as we have been and openly, that it only made her love me more.

She said that if we are being honest then she should share more of how she's feeling. What she said was that she has never felt better about herself or about us. She admitted that not having sex with me wasn't easy at first but now, it has become something that she too agrees has made things easier and smoother between us. Over these past few years with Paul, she said she'd really started to feel so much better about herself physically and emotionally - I smiled and told her that I could tell. She said that she loved that she felt so comfortable around Paul and how he makes her feel so sexy "even with this here" as she felt her little "mom roll" as she calls the few pounds she has around her mid-section right now. I told her she was sexy and that it's all in her head how sexy she feels. She didn't hold back and told me that the sex with Paul has only gotten better the more it's gone on and that "it felt wonderful" to have him literally fuck her for like 5 days straight. She said physically that while she surely felt sore afterwards, she told me that it felt wonderful to have this ache in her pussy afterwards and how alive it made her feel to feel that way. She told me she hoped that didn't hurt to hear her say - and I told her honestly - no - it was amazingly arousing to hear her say that.

She then said she'd be honest about what she wanted in the future. Surprise or maybe not a surprise - she had a very similar view towards the foreseeable future. She said that she thinks we will slowly resume having sex - and she giggled and said "and it'd better be like you said...." but then she was serious and said that she wanted sex to be different for us when we resumed as I'd said - for us to be more aware of each other and focus on that. She said to me that she wants to feel like she did on Fathers day - to feel aroused at the thought of me being in her and to then enjoy that feeling of allowing me inside her to pleasure her and myself. I told her it felt amazing and that I was still enjoying the thoughts of it now some 3 weeks later. She said that she agreed - it wasn't going to be frequent "at least not at first" and she said that she didn't want to hurt me or burst-my-bubble - but that she was thinking of once every few months, pretty much as we have been this year and she said that she wasn't thinking we'd be intimate again now for at least several more months. I did gulp a bit and I told her that I had wondered if it would be that long and she said that she very much wanted it to feel like it did for us on Fathers day - something to be savored and built-up to. And she giggled and said "besides, I do enjoy how it feels to not do it". I suppose my body language answered how that sounded to me as I am sure she saw me smile and respond favorably. I told her so, that "you sound like me" and then, like she had done, I asked her to tell me more about that.

She paused for a moment and then said that she was surprised at how it felt to not have sex with me, or at least "not like we used to". I nodded that I agreed and encouraged her to tell me how she felt as I had shared my thoughts. She smiled and said that at first, it felt like she was hurting me or she was concerned I would be mad about it. "But you enjoyed what we did last year" and she said that as the year went by she really started to feel more focused on what she was feeling. As she felt more and more control, she realized that she needed to feel some kind of "independence" (her word) sexually.

I realized we'd never really talked about it as she started to talk - that we'd never really talked about New Years. Sure enough she was the one who said it, "what you did on New Years baby..... it sooooo really helped me". I asked her "how" - it just felt like the right thing to ask. She said that it really let her know that I was okay with everything and she looked at me and said "that you'd be okay not having sex with me ". She went on to explain that once I had done that, that it seemed to mark the point where she truly accepted what she wanted to do and feel this year and that she knew I would be okay with it.

She actually was all smiles and had this gushingly warm sound in her voice as she told me that her decision to "have anal sex with him felt good to be something I could want and do". I told her that I supported her decision even if it stung that it may be something I don't get to have. She smiled and said "that's part of it baby, that I feel I can say that.... that I think I only want that to be for Paul". I looked at her and I told her that was so erotic to her her say and that I was okay if that's what she wanted. She just responded by saying "I love you" and she continued that she loved me and loved that I could let her feel this way. I told her that as long as I felt a part of it, that I would be okay and she giggled and said "you will baby you will".

but the discussion did go back to her enjoying denying me. She said there too it was something that the more she did it last year, the more she could feel herself being aroused by it and being aroused at seeing my response - to seeing that while frustrating to me that it also turned me on. She said that "I can see it in you on Wednesdays honey...." and she proceeded to tell me that my masturbation is different than it used to be - she tells me it seems deeper and that she thinks my cock is even bigger than she remembered it and that she really loves watching me knowing it's now something she is a part of. I told her she is the main part and she blushed and smiled and said again that she loves that she can see the "real you".

She said that now, "it must be kind of like you feel seeing me naked", that it turns you on to see it and to "know" that it's just not something we're doing right now. She told me how self-aware she is of her own body and desires now compared to earlier where sometimes she barely felt time to develop her own sexual desires before either I or her lover wanted her. She literally said to me that "how much sex I had with Paul was as much my desire as his". She looked at me and said that it felt so good to her to let herself feel that kind of desire and want for him. As we talked, I told her how I loved what she was saying and sharing and she blushed again and said that's why she'd said what she had about it being good for us. She continued by saying that she wanted this to continue but knew that we still need some "physical time" and said that's why when Fathers Day felt okay to her that she let things go further and she said that's why she feels comfortable about what she wants in terms of the future. She asked me again if "waiting longer" before doing it again was okay with me and I told her the honest answer, yes. She said that if it was something that turned us both on then we should be open about it and she asked me to say it to her and I did, I told her it was okay with me if we waited longer, possibly months, before we would be physical again as long as when we did, it could be something we both wanted and enjoyed and wanted for each other. She blushed and said "that is exactly what I want baby".

I thought we were done until she quipped "you know I'm not sure when you're going to get to cum in me though...." and then she smiled and giggled and said "....if....". And she looked at me for a second and then said "how does that make you feel?". I told her the honest truth - that I was wicked hard hearing her say that but then I added "again as long as it's something that turns you on baby". She took my hand and said "it does....". There was an awkward pause and she said "it's not something I expected to feel baby.... but it does make it so much better with Paul.....". She turned to me and said "it's just something that will come later on.... okay?". I told her yes. And then I said it, I told her that "if that's all that you deny me in the end, it'll be okay". She just hugged me.

Now, I'm not going to re-read all of this - I typed it as I could remember and recall and feel it - I have likely blended in some of my own thoughts or whatever from other conversations. I will say this - it feels very surreal to have literally talked about all of this as openly as this with her. But I have to say, just as telling her I felt beta and wanted to explore it - it feels great to have been almost brutally open and honest with her. She may not have asked me to "use the right words" but nonetheless, I think we shared something that will make things better and easier for us.

I should add that later on last night she giggled and said "you know, you do deserve something special this weekend". I did not ask more. But it did get me horny this morning when she continued to keep her panties on. After all we talked about, I could almost understand her wanting to prolong what she'd had with him.

 

[peakmb]

Well Steve, you're sure not in Kansas anymore are you?

 

[SquirmingSub]

Well Steve, you're sure not in Kansas anymore are you?

Peak - I have to say that reference made me laugh...

 

[ShadowCuck]

Wow. Both gut punchey and hawt, huh? How are you feeling about things?

I’m imagining you must be both both devastated and erotically thrilled about what Sue said and her intentions to not allow you PIV but once every few months, while she continues to get her need for lovemaking met with Paul, and takes delight in sharing something sexual with him that she appears to intend not ever to share with you, her husband. It’s so deliciously twisted!

 

[peakmb]

Steve,
Foreseeable future. A year a half max.

Within that time you were talking about retiring / moving away from your current location. Surely this changes things a little if it's still planned.

Within this time surely is Sue finally saying goodbye to Paul. He's already dangerously too close and getting closer now every month. It's also well beyond the point where Sue has said she was moving him on. Surely this changes things a little if it's still planned.

Sue still sees her most connected sex as being without a condom. Just forgetting for a moment what you think is sexy, think what she is saying here. She is saying she doesn't want you to get her deepest sexual connection ever again. Even if this turns you on, you have to see a danger signal here.

Sue has now discovered that she sometimes likes, even loves, anal sex. Fine, it's sexy at the moment for her to say she is denying you this, but again, forever going forward? Again she is saying that something she really enjoys she doesn't want to do with you. This is another 'Life of Brian' shoe. It's a sign.

It seems clear that Sue has hit her peak and rather than see it as living life in the relationship death zone, a place she can only enjoy safely for a short time, she thinks she quite likes being there and wants to stay for a while. You, on the other hand, are deep into your angst zone. The place where she could almost tell you to cut off your left nut and you would think seriously about it. It's a zone in the past where you have had great difficulty in saying No to Sue or even thinking in those terms. Almost like the Stockholm Syndrome. I'm not saying the targets you have both set for yourselves above are wrong or even unrealistic, but I am saying you might feel differently in three or six months. Maybe leave some wriggle room on the final agreement.

I suspect you may feel increasingly let down / disappointed over the next three to six months but I now think you need to let Sue have this space for a bit longer. I do think if you do get more frustrated by it though you should be clear that you are giving her the space but that you are less and less happy about it. It seems like the signal to tone it down more may have to come from you even if the final decision is made by Sue.

If you can say clearly that a move is not planned in this time, that you are happy Paul is now staying connected, that you genuinely see no danger signs in Sue's (not yours) sexual preferences with you, and that you are genuinely now happy about your sex being reduced to a partially disconnected fuck once every three months, then I will back off banging on about it.

Either way, I hope that Sue has dropped off her high enough from last weekend for you to both enjoy this one. Whatever the surprise is.

 

[tegelad]

Congratulations on achieving a major milestone!

Maybe food for thought is that you and Sue look at revisiting your vows and creating a little ceremony formalizing her full sexual independence and marking that she is free to engage in sex with only alpha males. You could make it a fun ceremony where like on New Year's you give her away one last time to her current partner.

You do you of course, but I believe from my vantage point that part of your wife does still want you to go alpha (consensually of course) and reclaim her fully. Each escalation is a test to see if it activates something in you. That being said she does very much love you and wants you as a friend and partner in life albeit a platonic one.

In my opinion, if you do want to reform your relationship back to include intercourse, you may need to look at learning to deny yourself self pleasure since New Year's Day you took a new vow (and that is totally cool with no judgements from me ) to have and to hold your hand for release. One fun thing you could play with is talking to her about requesting her consent to masterbate. If you are truly beta, her needs are the only thing that matters in her house when it comes to sexual matters.

Congratulations again on achieving your goals and being a fantastic partner to your wife. Also thank you for sharring such deep intimacy and personal feelings with us all over the years..

 

[SoonToBe]

So, I didn't post anything since Friday obviously for a reason. We spent a lot of time talking this weekend and it's interesting to see how our conversations veered away from the narrative that Peak has provided.

One thing that was clear from our discussions is that nothing we talked about was truly long-term as both of us agreed that we could say what we thought we'd like based on where we are now - but that nothing can be guaranteed for the future. It helped us focus things as she too felt that we should talk and continue to talk as right now, she feels she can be very open and honest about how she's feeling. I told her, and she agreed, that we can talk and say what we think we'd like to have happen or what we'd like to feel, but that nothing can be for certain in reality.

But the main part of our discussion was about denial and how that felt for both of us. I told her that I was concerned that things might not be good for us if we kept going as-is. She honestly asked me "why not?". She said that as long as it was good for me, that it was good for her. I asked her if it was good for her and she said that she was actually far more concerned about me and the effects of continued denial than she was about herself. As I had already shared, I told her that I liked what we were doing and that, as crazy as it sounds, while I did miss intercourse with her, that if it were up to me, that I honestly thought and would be okay with foregoing it as we move ahead. She asked me if I still felt 'beta'. And I told her an honest 'yes' and we talked more about my feelings about it. I told her that I couldn't rule out feeling differently in the future, but I also told her that right now, I was very content with what we were doing and not having sex with her. I told her that I hoped that wasn't something that hurt her to hear or that made her feel that I loved her any less or anything like that. She told me she understood that and said again that I can't necessarily control what turns me on or makes me feel fulfilled and that it was okay and she admitted that she too had similar thoughts about her own self.

I told her that it was still hard for me to accept that I truly wanted to not have sex with her but it is how I feel. I told her that while I loved what we did on Fathers Day, that I wanted it to be as she wanted it and that I still very much wanted to feel not having sex with her for longer. She said that she didn't think any less of me and still loved me deeply, but she said again that she understood what I was saying and feeling and that I shouldn't think badly about it. She admitted that she still found it very romantic that her pleasure is still what turns me on the most even if it isn't me providing it. I told her that I still liked how it felt to know that Paul was her main sexual partner.

She was honest and she said that "when it first happened... you and this beta thing...." that it did bother her. I told her I was sorry but she then said that it was a good thing because it was part of what led her to understand what she wanted to feel and to feel like. She said that when I said I wanted to be more beta, and give more of her sexual pleasure to Paul to satisfy, that she was hurt, but she says it also led her to having to tell herself that she should enjoy the sex and that she should take what she wanted out of it. I told her I hadn't intended that necessarily but that I loved what it has done for her. She smiled and said that Paul had a lot to do with it and she quipped that he was the "right guy for me". I told her that it wasn't easy for me to tell her all of that but that I felt a lot better about everything since then. I told her that I didn't know if the feelings would change over time but that lately I'd been feeling more and more that maybe they won't.

Her reply to that was to remind me that she has changed and that "all of this" doesn't happen without her feeling differently. She said that for right now, she doesn't want to think of me as her sex partner. That seeing me as non-sexual is easier for her as she openly said that she's "not through with Paul yet" and that she still wants to have more time with him exclusively. She also told me that, as she told me last year and the year before, that she does feel differently about me and that she feels different towards me sexually than she has in the past. I asked her what she meant and she basically said that for her, knowing her pussy isn't just for me, and now, isn't for me at all, has made her feel more confident and made her feel to enjoy things more. She looked at me and said that "the stuff you've done" and she mentioned my acceptance of everything on our ski-trips and my "giving me away" on New Years, that she says she is quite content thinking of me more beta now and that it's something she's actually coming to enjoy.

We talked more about it and she said that since the weekend with Paul that she has become very aware that she is very independent sexually now and that she feels so empowered about her own sexuality. She said that my being beta let her accept that she has her own desires and even needs that she wants to be able to satisfy. She told me pretty explicitly how she wanted Paul to fuck her so much while they were away and it wasn't that she wanted to do it for me or for Paul - but that she wanted it. She so wanted to feel him fuck her until she'd cum and cum and cum. But she said she felt it most when she came home, at how much she wanted to keep her panties on - both to keep the feelings from the weekend lingering - but she also said that she knew it would probably turn me on and that she did like that too.

She asked me again about denial and how I felt about it and I told her honestly. That it was the most exciting and arousing thing to me to know that she isn't available for me sexually, that she wanted to be his. She looked at me and said that was how she felt and that she liked that I accepted it. I told her that it had always turned me on and she giggled and we reminisced for a little bit. It was her that said that we were going to "likely" resume having intercourse at some point (again - we agreed to not define when) - but that it was as we'd talked, not something that I was going to have control over "probably not ever again baby...." and she said that she doubted that she would ever want to feel submissive or whatever to me where she would acquiesce to my sexual needs even if she weren't necessarily in the mood. I told her that was okay and I had accepted that as a likely outcome for the truly longer-term, she smiled and said that was good for her to hear as she too was concerned about that.

As we talked she told me that anally and vaginally she wanted to feel that she was very much "his" and that "those places" on her were only for him. She said that having shared that "and more" for the 4 days she was away was amazing for her and that she loved how she felt about it. I told her that it had and still does turn me on and she smiled and said that was good and she asked me what I thought would be for us in the future - "what do you want me to deny you baby?".

It was a big moment - it was the first time we'd gotten to this point where we'd both felt genuinely good and it wasn't a Wednesday night either. I asked her what she was feeling about denial and she smiled and said that "it's a lot of fun to see you enjoy it" and then she said "at first it was kind of weird, but now, I like it - I like how it makes me feel around you" and she went on to say that while she did miss some aspects of physical sex with me, she too said that "it's hot to not let you" and how that feeling has grown over time. She said that sharing that only with Paul has led her to where she likes how it feels to not be with me sexually and how she likes to not feel a need or urge or desire when we're together. I asked her how she thought that would be going forward and that was when she said again how she "knows" she will want me physically again at some point "so you can relax about that baby" and she quipped "he'll (meaning my cock) will be in me again". But she said that she's not sure when or when we do start, how much she'll want. I told her that was okay and that I was happy to work along with her as long as we felt as we do now - content and happy with each other. She hugged me and kissed me and then said "lets get to that point honey, where you know, every few months we start to explore more together". I told her that would be fine. She giggled and said "we'll talk about condoms after that" which made me turn to look at her and she just said "that's the last thing that's going to come back between us baby...." and then she added and said "or should I tease you and say 'if it comes back'" and she smiled and said "I know you like using them baby, and I do too so lets just leave it at that".

Now of course at the end of all of this she smiled and said "I don't know about you but all this talk has me quite wet and bothered" to which I replied by showing her the lump in my pants. She smiled and said my reward was getting to watch - and we both proceeded to get naked and watch each other masturbate".

 

[Enigma632]

Well, it seems as if both Steve and Sue are in a happy place where they have both got something in a way better than they expected.

I do think that Steve's "denial" is probably the nicest, friendliest "denial" that I have ever heard of LOL

 

[SquirmingSub]

Steve - while the lifestyle choice is not for everyone, it is good to see that you and Sue have come to an understanding and are both enjoying this.

 

[ShadowCuck]

I find myself wondering what the “and more” is that Sue mentioned about the weekend.

Sounds like y’all are really happy!

 

[peakmb]

Steve,
Thank you for posting your most recent update. I think it is clearer to me now what the immediate future looks like for all of you. To infer a little, I now assume that any talk of relocating has been deferred until after the 'immediate future' period is well over, and that any thought of Sue retiring Paul - so long stated by her - has evaporated in the sunlight of your new upland meadow.

As others have stated, you now seem to genuinely have what both of you want, and Paul too seems happy with what he gets. I can't see it as denial of you because it's actually something you desire and prefer, both at the moment and it seems for some considerable time to come. Indeed, it almost seems that Sue talking of a final (far future) reconnection is another sort of denial of what you might really still want. It is perhaps the only ongoing tension still remaining going forward and even that is now unlikely to manifest itself for a year or more if your current preferences continue.

This is perhaps a shame because your story to date has been largely about the tension between wants and desires, sex and love making over the last ten years or so. A see saw relationship that had Sue bouncing from old lover, then back to you than again, then towards a new lover each time the previous one had served his purpose or exhausted Sue's interest in him. That tension has now gone and seems unlikely to be replaced for a long time, and then only with a much weakened version as your sexual relationship goes quietly into the night.

I will admit it is not something I could be happy with myself, nor did I expect that in the final analysis it was something you would be happy long term with yourself, but I finally have to accept that it is, and I wish you and Sue well with it. Bon voyage.

 

[ShadowCuck]

Oh, I’m also curious to know what the “surprise” was.

 

[SoonToBe]

I think I can say that I feel strangely content today.

I know it's not what every guy would say and it's surely not what I would have thought I would be saying, but I think for both of us, the explicit conversation we had was relieving in a lot of ways. Last night in bed she commented that it was "good we really talked" and she said that she loved me and loved that we could do something like this. We talked a bit and she said that she could see that I was more relaxed and she rolled over next to me and we just kind of lay there together for a bit. I had my hand in her hair and when I put it lower around her shoulder, she surprised me and put my hand on her breast and she said softly "you can feel them" and that she still liked feeling my hands tenderly like that. We spooned up to watch TV for a bit and she put my hand back on her breast. She turned to me and said "it's okay if you're hard, I don't mind...." and with that she snuggled in and without a doubt she could fee my hard cock against her, feeling her breasts and nipples in my hand had me almost there already.

This is the thing. I honestly was happy to lie there with her and just feel her and to let myself enjoy my horniness without expecting - or I'll say it - without wanting her. I mean sure I would have loved to have fucked her right then - but at the same time, I know she didn't want me to and honestly, for as good as it would have been, it felt better in a way to not have her and for her to know that.

When we turned the lights out a little while later she kissed me and hugged me and then said softly "you can take care of that if you want honey" and she kissed me again and turned over to fall asleep. I was really horny as she well knew and it only took me just a few minutes to cum. I rolled over away from her as I let go and to not make a mess in the bed, I tried to catch it with my other hand. I guess I wasn't as quiet as I'd thought as she rolled over a second later and whispered "you can lick it up if you want to.... I know you do sometimes.... I think it's sexy.....". She rolled back over and for a moment I was frozen until I thought about it and did as she'd suggested.

So as I said, I feel content today. Peak, you almost seem to be saying good bye given what Sue and I have thought of as our equilibrium for now. I have to say that what others have said about how they feel about their wives at this point with reduced or even no sexual contact - that I can identify with that right now. What I used to think was crazy or extreme now doesn't seem that way. I know it seems crazy but I genuinely love knowing that she wants this too - that she wants to feel this passion and pleasure with Paul. I really don't mind - kind of like her enjoying seafood and me maybe not. I know it's not the same - but I think it shares some of the same feelings it gives you as the observer.

I admit that I still feel many misgivings and still feel at times that "wow, this is crazy" - but those are so few and far-between. I would say that not having those feelings at all while she was away is indicative of a change in me. Even now, she's only begun to share a little more about the long-weekend with him - but it's just so erotic to hear her let loose more details.

More later but if not - Happy 4th everyone (maybe not for our UK friends).

 

[Curt Bruch]

Sounds as if you are in a good place Steve and I'm pleased for you. As a btw here in the UK I do 'observe' Independence day but with a tinge of sadness for had the US not decided a couple of hundred years back to go their own way there would not be all the turmoil being wrought by your present leader and you could still be enjoying the benign benevolence that comes from living under our gracious monarchy! (Just kidding, have a great holiday.)