Denial discussion

  • Thread starterSoonToBe
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  • #201
Had a few moments before bed - Sue turned in early to be ready for tomorrow and as I'd said earlier, I'm quite horny and hoping to relieve the tension before bed.

Bev - they're not totally obvious but they are in the nightstand next to the bottle of Astroglide and a bottle of Slippery silicone lubricant - so if she were to look she'd see more than just a box of condoms. Sue's toys are in a drawer under the bed (platform bed) - if our daughter were commenting on condoms I am curious myself at what her response would be to various dildo's, vibrators and other toys she'd find - lol....

Anyway - I think I've shared quite a bit this evening. I admit that my cock was throbbing and leaking as I was typing earlier - it felt good to say what was on my mind.
 
  • #202
SoonToBe said:

It's going to sound crazy but I couldn't get the thought of them out of my mind last night - as we fucked in our bed all I could think about was Robert having her bare in like 13 hours from now and that I have willingly given that up. When I look at her and hear the excitement in her voice as she tells me about her maturing and growing sexual desires - and that she's embracing the idea that I want her to give him something that I used to have.

I think that perhaps that is one facet of my desire to be the beta-male - it makes me horny like nothing else to think that I've agreed with her to give that peak moment of pleasure with her to another man. No matter what I think of it comes back to my knowing that she will share that freely with Robert and others I'm sure and that I may only get to feel it on limited occasions. I cannot express the arousal I feel and yet, at the same time, the overwhelming desire to eagerly experience waiting until I will get to feel her again.

I know for her, she is enamored with only have her lovers's cum in her and that is the facet that seems to define the pleasure she feels. Mine is a different form - yes, that only her lover's cum is in her is a part of it - but that she will only experience that pleasure of him putting it in her with him is what I think most defines where my arousal comes from.

Several times now I've gone back and re-read my earlier posts from my earliest points of acting on these desires - both situations with her IUD. How I didn't recognize it then I don't know - but re-reading what I encouraged her to do only reinforces my acceptance of my desire. She knows I am glad I encouraged her as I did and now she understands a bit more of it too. I feel that same rush - that same intense sexual thrill - that same shiver up my back each time we use a condom together. I do love how she looks at me and knowing it or not - her enjoyment of it and her agreement and desire for me to do so - it is so much of what makes it more intense. I love knowing that she knows and understands that I want her to have that sexual moment only with her lover. So when she tells me it's been 40+ times that she's been with him - it is even more intense to think about.

My god my cock is hard after spilling all of that - no doubt of what I'll be doing shortly.

Will - you may be right that I am the last person to admit that I am, or at least I want to be a sub in this way to her.

Steve-Many recent posts have offered conflicting opinions on whether or not you are a "SUB". These same conflicting opinions have also debated whether using this particular label or any label is in fact desirable, in reference to your particular current situation. I believe that your above quote would qualify as a fairly accurate description of how a "SUB" might think/feel.
Although I myself often have concerns with using labels, reading the insights you conjure and the clarity with which you detail your thoughts/desires when you give yourself permission to be a "SUB" (as you have done above), IMO, speaks to the question in the first argument, and proves the need in the second argument.
Again IMO, the degree to which you are able to embrace your "new label" will correspond directly to the overall level of intensity you feel towards the game. Just as it did through your last post!!!
 
  • #203
cscguy said:
Steve-Many recent posts have offered conflicting opinions on whether or not you are a "SUB". These same conflicting opinions have also debated whether using this particular label or any label is in fact desirable, in reference to your particular current situation. I believe that your above quote would qualify as a fairly accurate description of how a "SUB" might think/feel.
Although I myself often have concerns with using labels, reading the insights you conjure and the clarity with which you detail your thoughts/desires when you give yourself permission to be a "SUB" (as you have done above), IMO, speaks to the question in the first argument, and proves the need in the second argument.
Again IMO, the degree to which you are able to embrace your "new label" will correspond directly to the overall level of intensity you feel towards the game. Just as it did through your last post!!!

"A Rose By Any Other Name"
 
  • #204
Well Steve,
It's just about Noon, Maybe Sue & Robert will take a lunch break. I don't know how you will get any work done today. Their activities is on my mind a lot today. I'll be waiting for your next update.

Rick
 
  • #205
The fuller quote is,
"A name. What's in a name. That which we call a rose would smell as sweet by any other name."
What Shakespear meant was that names don't matter. It's what you are that does. Which is what some of us have been saying all along.

Steve, you are what you are at each moment. In your case that has been slowly evolving over the last 5 years and will continue to do so over the next 5 years too. I still don't believe you sit comfortably into any classic stereotype but that doesn't bother me at all. If your sometime sub feelings evolve, you may be attracted by Sue taking complete control of your orgasms, or sharing that control with a new lover. Maybe even engaging in a bit of teasing and denial, even some humiliation. I can't see you or Sue going for any of that at the moment though. Or any time soon really. I think you are more likely to revert back to your previous norms to restore for a while before setting forth again with someone really radical maybe later next year.

Whatever. What really matters at the moment is how Sue comes off the peak she is creating for herself today. This may end up being her last time with Robert, certainty her last special time and what follows may well be hurried and perhaps a little sordid for her. I can't see Tony filling those boots any time soon really. She might even need you to!
 
  • #206
Peak

well said hope that sue's normal time with robert does not. upset her to bad now that him and her are just fb's now.
she should be at home now. with steve hope he can bring her back up if it did not go well for her today. she maybe looking for a lot of huggs and ect.
after her spending alday in his bed.

STB
keep us posted.
 
  • #207
peakmb said:
The fuller quote is,
"A name. What's in a name. That which we call a rose would smell as sweet by any other name."
What Shakespear meant was that names don't matter. It's what you are that does. Which is what some of us have been saying all along.

QUOTE]

Yea I know what the full quote is. I also Know what Shakespear meant by it. Some Of Us just said it a lot sooner.

There are many ways to describe the same thing. All are right. Dom Beta Bottom. Are any of them wrong? Peak You look at things threw Your Own Eyes. Your own experiences. Your entitled. But I also Look at the world through My Life Experiences. We use different words to describe the same thing. We say Panties here. While You would say knickers. Neither of us is wrong.
 
  • #208
I see that my quick update of this morning didn't make it to the website - I'd posted just after she'd left and had some intense thoughts at the time.
Thankfully they passed - but I am now waiting for her to return home - she texted me just after 6pm that she'd be leaving soon. I don't quite know how they could have been fucking for 10 hours but who knows - I hope she'll share with me when she gets home tonight.

Fortunately I was busy most of the day at work - it's always craziest right up to the Thanksgiving holiday and then it turns into a graveyard - so there's hope for next week to be the end of the end-of-year rush. But for a good while this morning I admit I was VERY horny even after last night that I am on the edge of my seat hoping she'll be home soon - before our daughter gets home - and that hopefully she'll be in the mood to share with me.

For Peak and Will - I think my reluctance to accept the label of Sub for me - at least in my head is because I feel it's me that wants to deny myself and not that it's being ******/coerced or that I'm being led to accept it. I guess it's still submissive even if it's self-created - but I think that's where I may be getting hung up in my head. All I know is that I'd explode if she offered me a chance to use a condom with her tonight and to know what I wouldn't be feeling - I'm getting light-headed just thinking about it. Its so weird to have found something so strange that has such an effect on my libido.
 
  • #209
Steve, again Sub submissive beta. Whatever You or anyone else wants to call it.

Do You really have "Free Will" as to weather or not You wear that condom? Or Even if You get to have Sue Tonight?
(I guess on one level You do). But You know the real answer to that. Sue tell You when where and how You get to cum. Sue controls it. What do You call someone who let allows another to have that kind of power over them??? I know what I call them. And your happier than You ever have been in Years.
 
  • #210
I'll put aside the whole sub-discussion for now.

I just had to share that Sue did come home just about 7:30pm and after a short period of us hugging and kissing and me sort of calming her down a bit as she was a little emotional at it maybe having been her last time spending a lot of time with Robert, she warmed up and as we kissed she looked at me and asked if I wanted to "go upstairs" with her.

I was totally surprised as I thought she'd be in a hands-off mood. Upstairs she undressed down to her panties and lay on the bed and when I had done the same I lay next to her and we kissed again and she said "you can have me if you want" and said something that she wanted to share the "last time" with Robert. She later admitted that she hoped and even expected to see him again as he intimated he too wasn't ready to "leave her sweet pussy behind".

I was totally nervous - again that first-date feeling swept over me - as I slid her panties off and revealed her beautiful body in all it's splendor. I immediately saw that even with her legs together that her pussy was swollen and quite reddened as was her whole mound around it. I knelt eagerly between her legs as she slowly and very seductively spread them in front of me. Oh my god - she looked just so beautiful. Her outer labia was very reddened and swollen and she smiled and said that he'd been very physical with her most of the day - she admitted to him fucking her for hours on and off. As she spread them more - the swollen outer lips parted and revealed her gorgeous recently-fucked pussy. The inner labia were engorged and bright red and as the spread apart, it revealed the entrance to her vagina which was equally reddened deep inside and oh so swollen open too. In the 10 seconds it took for her to spread her legs, a small dribble of clearish liquid began to appear inside her.

I was besides myself and she giggled at the moment I waited to just look over her whole body and appreciate her. She looked up at me and just said "you can have me baby".... and a second later she just said "you can have me but just don't suck it all out of me" and she giggled. That giggle turned into a loud laugh as I literally DOVE into her tongue first. Oh my god - all I could taste was sex - her sweetness mixed with the undeniable taste of his cum. She let me lick all over including pushing my tongue up into her gaping pussy - I didn't suck at her but I didn't need to - the budding orgasm I was giving her swept over her and her climax caused her pussy to contract rewarding me with a gush of thin but very wet and pungent tasting cum. I swear I nearly came as my cock throbbed as I licked around. It surprised me how quickly she reached her first orgasm - but as I felt her hand on the back of my head gently, I knew she wanted me to take her there and so I did. That gentle orgasm swirled into a moment of moaning and writhing on the bed that turned me on incredibly. But it was how she tasted - my god - it was the first time she'd let me truly go down on her in months and months after she'd come home. I realized I missed it so much!!!! Even though my cock was dying for attention - I was totally consumed with consuming her!!! I pushed her legs back and apart and she didn't resist - and as I licked and sucked and flicked at her clit - she became more and more intensely aroused and I knew that what she really wanted was to have a deep orgasm with me at that moment. I brought my fingers in and I probed her stretched pussy as I licked and I could feel her pulsating, contracting as I licked and sucked all around. I thought she'd complain with my fingers in her - especially when I pulled them back and brought forth more of the cum that he'd left in her.

It was weird - at one point I actually considered whether I wanted to fuck her or to let her enjoy the oral-sex with me and maybe wait. But that wasn't to be. When I came up after she'd calmed down from her huge orgasm she looked at me and said "you can have me if you want". I don't think I've ever put a condom on so quickly - I was halfway through when I realized that she hadn't said I needed to use one, I just did it automatically - but when I looked at her and saw that same smile as always, I knew she was happy I was using one.

It had been so long since I'd fucked her so close after she'd been with Robert - for a moment, I think I forgot I even had the condom on. But as I pushed into her she moaned deeply and pulled her knees back and I immediately realized just how wet and open she was as I slid in effortlessly. She moaned as I bottomed out in her and I will admit that the sensation of only feeling her through the condom somehow totally excited me. My god was she wet and open as we started fucking and I was able to plunge in and out of her with ease. She giggled at me and said something about his cum being a good lubricant.

I knew it wasn't going to take me long to cum though and she knew it too - she started to tease me about "come on baby and fill the rubber up" and as I got closer she must have realized that I wanted her to tease me more and she said "he made me cum a lot today" - that got me going but when she started to tell me how she felt giving herself to him one last time and how she said she held him in her until he fell-out - I was sooo close. That was when she looked up at me and said " you'll get to feel me that way next month baby" - wow - I was right at the edge. I can't remember what she said exactly but it included something about her telling me to "think about him feeling me bare inside". That did it. I moaned loudly and even she moaned as I thrust into her those last few times. She knew I was cummming and held me close and said again how I'll get to feel her next month.

We talked for a while as we lay there all sweaty - but that will have to wait till later as I need to get going now.
 
  • #211
STB,
Woww. Forget the lables, what a day for Sue and what a night for you both. Pure unadulterated passion. She could so easily have played the tease and denial card. Too tired, too sore, wanting to savour her last full day etc.. but none of it. Sue wanted and needed to share it with you and you needed that too. A perfect end to what must have been close to a perfect day for her and maybe for you too. I am so happy for you both. Whatever happens next that will be a day to remember. Thank you so much for continuing to be so open and sharing it with us all.
 
  • #212
Peak - thanks - my cock is still a little numb from the intensity last night. There was more that was said - and I'm sure, quite sure, that more will be said tonight as even though I'm pleasantly satisfied from last night - the thought of being with her again tonight and of her maybe/probably sharing more is something I'd want for sure. I got home little early and I'll get dinner started in a little bit to pave the way for tonight.

But I want to post here now and say for sure that I am loving the role I'm assuming with her. The things she said and the way she was last night - it was just perfect. Feeling her - but knowing that I wasn't feeling her - I can't describe how horny it made me. I looked down at her legs spread and my cock in her and I could see the ring of the condom at the base of my cock - and in my head - it was just intense to know that I wasn't truly feeling her and even more so - that Robert had felt her - all day. I could feel the slipperiness and the warmth deep in her - but I couldn't feel the wetness! That thought drove me insane with desire. When I did finally cum - knowing the condom would keep it all in and keep it from her - I KNOW it is one of the thoughts that pushed me over the edge. Even now - a day later - yes, I surely miss feeling her so intimately - but at the same time, even now I can still remember and feel how intense my orgasm was.

If this is being a sub - then that is surely what I am. Why I want this, I don't know - why does one person like broccoli and another doesn't - it is as Will says. Like I said, it is an eerie feeling to have found something that touches me so deeply like this does.

Anyway - gotta run.
 
  • #213
Steve just go with it.
 
  • #214
After the euphoria of Tuesday night I suspect Wednesday may have been a little more reflective than usual. The future finally having arrived and all that. I hope all went well.
 
  • #215
Reflective, I suppose, revealing, maybe....

I don't know exactly how it came up but I wound up reminding her that it felt like another "first date" for us on Tuesday night and I reminded her how it felt to get the girl home and not totally know what I'd find beneath her clothes and how she'd be sexually, etc.

That led to a bit of a discussion that got me horny when she said that we should maybe play with that and kind of play up that each time we get together that we'd be like boyfriend/girlfriend and that she could be (and she mentioned it - not me) like we were when we first met and she giggled a little and said again how she remembered she was still having sex with other guys when we first started to date. I was already stroking my cock as we talked about this. I reminded her that I always went bare with her back then and she said something like "I was always having to clean up" or something like that - but she said that maybe we should play it like I didn't. And she proceeded to tell me that from now until Christmas, she'll play up that "maybe soon" I'll get to go bare with her!

When she saw that this was really hitting the mark for me - maybe by my moaning or just how rigid my cock was she played it up more and more and at some point getting me to tell her how horny I'm going to be waiting for then. She teased about her wanting to wait for the "right moment" with me but then teasing more that sometimes she's "bad" with other guys - and she like started to tease me openly about how Robert had cum in her on Tuesday. Like I said, I've been more open with her and I told her that it turned me on that he'd done that to her and that I hadn't yet.

I know it may not seem like much - it was definitely a sexy kind of teasing. But as it went on she turned to me and said "you really want to wait don't you?". I didn't know if she was still in this role-playing thing or whether she was asking me outright - but my answer was the same "yes". She told me when I said that , that she still couldn't totally understand how that turned me on - to "give that up with me". I answered her honestly and said that it was part of what I'd wanted - to be the beta for her. I didn't use those words but it's easier to say it that way here. She held me and said "you really want that don't you".

We had a poignant moment right then. I told her yes and I held her and said that I couldn't explain it but that it was what I wanted and I simply said that I "wanted to do my part". She kissed me and I think there might have been a bit of a tear in her eye as she hugged me. When we broke the kiss and hug, her mood had lightened and she looked down towards my cock and giggled at how hard I was and she smiled at me and said "okay".

I can't say for sure but I think it might have been a defining moment because in the next few minutes she turned up the heat for sure! She started to tease me more in this sarcastic voice - "awww, are you missing feeling me baby?" and I felt her move closer next to me. "Did you like knowing Robbie had cum in me yesterday? ..... you know it was like 3 times.....". And then she said it "that's 3 more times than you have....." - and just the sound alone in her voice as she said that was enough to make me rock hard - but hearing her say it so sexily and playfully - and yes, so teasingly - holy crap it was crazy.

And to think I was concerned about getting it up again after Tuesday night! She cooed in my ear - "I loved you putting on your rubber yesterday" (what she call condoms) and then she said it "I didn't want you to cum in me". She said more but I was so taken with what she'd already said that my head was spinning. The next thing that I actually heard from her was something like "that's just for Robert" - and that was it - I spurted and spurted and spurted - even bringing an "oooh" from Sue at the suddenness an intensity.

I was totally spent after that, I just kind of laid there for a moment breathing deeply. As I lay there she moved up next to my head and kissed my cheek and said "it really turns me on baby" - and a moment later as she started to play with and feed me my cum she again said "lets have some fun with this baby".
 
  • #216
STB

sound's like the normal end with robert is going to be good for you. and look's like sue may have it worked out for now. till she find's someone new.

keep us posted. and have fun and enjoy it while you can.
 
  • #217
Thanks Steve for your life! Wow! I was wondering about something. I know you said that you felt more excited about not ever seeing Robert and I get it. But since the relationship is drawing to an end, do you think you might ever like to have Sue point him out (maybe not meet him) but just visualize what he looks like to add to some vizualizations?
 
  • #218
Cleaner - yes, I've mentioned it to Sue that I"d like to at least know what Robert looked like - she's giggled and said "one day I'll point him out to you" (when we're at her work or a work-related thing).

I will say that my new "understanding" of my desires gives me pause to look at a lot of other cuckold-related things differently.
I'd long questioned the truth of much of the humiliation or other things that I'd considered to be more extreme. But seeing as we've embarked on something that others might consider equally unconventional, perhaps those are also ultimately based in truth for many.

More later.
 
  • #219
SoonToBe said:
I will say that my new "understanding" of my desires gives me pause to look at a lot of other cuckold-related things differently. I'd long questioned the truth of much of the humiliation or other things that I'd considered to be more extreme. But seeing as we've embarked on something that others might consider equally unconventional, perhaps those are also ultimately based in truth for many.

Very interesting, STB. I think most of us with cuckold inclinations come to the realization (and acceptance) of depth and breadth of our desires only very slowly. It's difficult, isn't it? To have such strong urges so much at odds with the conventional understanding of how men are supposed to act, of how marriages are supposed to be? I think it is particularly difficult for some men -- those who have a strong and satisfying match -- to open up and share their darker desires with their wives; frightening to disclose things that might fracture that perfect relationship.

But some men are lucky. You're one of them, Steve. Whether because of the slow and deliberate way you've "brought each other along" this path of cuckolding and self-understanding, or maybe just that Sue is a natural cuckoldress, you have a mate and a relationship that seem perfectly suited for even more mutual exploration of your sexual desires. This is why I've sometimes encouraged you to open up and share your fantasies and thoughts with Sue, to the same degree and the same way you do with this forum. It seems so clear that your relationship can handle it. Actually, I'd go further and speculate that not only would Sue continue to love and respect you, she would probably love the liberation that "complete truth" would bring.

I know how scary it can be to let the person who loves you suspect that "you" might be different than the one she's lived with. But wow, if any relationship could handle it, it seems like yours could, and if any wife would accept and help you, it seems like Sue would. You've disclosed so much already, and it's resulted in such mutual happiness, and she clearly wants even more of it.

Here's a small, but concrete example. A few times, you've described your desires for her to treat you sexually as the "beta-male" in her life; but you immediately say that you've used other words with her besides "beta." I wonder what words? And should you ask yourself, why are you reluctant to use that phrase? What does it say about your reluctance to "******" to her (and maybe even to yourself) just how deep your cucky nature might be?

The reason I've encouraged mutual fantasy play -- play that exposes your kinkiest wants -- is that it's a way to dip into these areas with your lovely cuckoldress, without irrevocably "committing" to it in real life. If either of you don't like a particular fantasy or direction, you'll know it, and won't be inclined to go there. And I've frequently noted that it might be a way for you to reconcile the tension between your deepest cuck desires, on the one hand, and your need on the other hand that "it be real" for Sue, or that "she must want it herself." I think I really understand how much better it is for you, that she really wants this or that, and isn't pretending for your sake, but she's growing and exploring herself and her insecurities about what you might think of her, if she reveals her dirty inner self. Complete honesty between you two seems possible, and I would continue to urge you to open up even more with the beautiful, loving, and as far as I can see, perfectly accepting person you are married to.

With the Robert era coming to an end, maybe it's the perfect time to "go deep" with Sue in the fantasy world, Maybe agree that each of you will write down one sexy scenario that you haven't shared -- not one that you'd ever necessarily want to happen in real life. ***** by pirates? Fucked by a dog? Dominated by her basketball playing bull? Who knows what it might be. And none of us need to know it. I wonder if it's time for Sue to know more about the cuckold Steve than we do?

You're a hero to so many of us, Steve. You've got a relationship that all of us would envy,you've got a treasure of a wife, and you are as accomplished a diarist as I've ever encountered. Thanks again for letting us go along with you on your excellent sexual journey!
 
  • #220
Cocu - wow - you've said a lot that's rung true and, perhaps as you suggest, during the post-Robert period, perhaps we will delve further into each others desires. I've avoided clinical or more extreme descriptions of my desires with her - much like I don't usually call her pussy a cunt, it's just not how she responds. I have used the term cuckold before with her, but she, I think, views that in a more derogatory sense. Instead of alpha and beta, I've told her that I don't want to be her main-guy sexually and I have told her that I liked knowing she enjoyed sharing those pleasures with another guy - so she's fairly clear on things now. There's more that I'd like to reply about but don't have enough time to say more now.

I wanted to put a quick comment here before Cocu's post - that she is certainly warming up to the ideas of teasing me and playing this up. We were in the food-store earlier and we went up the medicine/female-stuff aisle and she stopped like half-way up. I walked up to the cart and she looked around and then asked me if I liked the condoms we were using and if I'd like to try any other ones "you know, while we get to know each other better". Oh my god, my cock grew hard as I realized what she was was saying. "or do you feel enough with the one's we're using". She had this huge smile on her face as she teased me for that minute of time. She kissed me and said "until we're closer baby, you're the only one using them with me" and that if I like them then we can move on. I was speechless as she walked ahead of me and I swear she wiggled her butt back at me. Thankfully I had the shopping cart in front of me to hide the lump in my jeans.

We didn't mess around last night and my god does she have me horny for tonight now.

Gotta run.